Just to see where some of the members stand. Hopefully no debates for this thread.

[SavedByTheLord]

So there are some that would consider themselves Calvinists and some Arminian.
Now from what I have been observing some Calvinists believe in infant baptism and some Arminian too.
Also, from what I have been observing some who are Arminian believe saved person can lose their salvation.
So if some members would please post the following information.

Do you consider yourselves Calvinists or Arminian or do you consider yourself something else?
Do you believe that infant baptism is required for salvation?
Do you believe that a saved person can lose their salvation?

I am just Christian and believe the word of God. I know that the name can mean anything today.
I do not believe that infant baptism is Biblical or that water baptism or infant baptism is require or helps in salvation.
I do not believe that a saved person can lose salvation. Once saved by the Lord Jesus Christ always saved by the Lord Jesus Christ.

And again if you post, please refrain from debates in this thread.

 

[Howie]

So there are some that would consider themselves Calvinists and some Arminian.
Now from what I have been observing some Calvinists believe in infant baptism and some Arminian too.
Also, from what I have been observing some who are Arminian believe saved person can lose their salvation.
So if some members would please post the following information.

Do you consider yourselves Calvinists or Arminian or do you consider yourself something else?
Do you believe that infant baptism is required for salvation?
Do you believe that a saved person can lose their salvation?

I am just Christian and believe the word of God. I know that the name can mean anything today.
I do not believe that infant baptism is Biblical or that water baptism or infant baptism is require or helps in salvation.
I do not believe that a saved person can lose salvation. Once saved by the Lord Jesus Christ always saved by the Lord Jesus Christ.

And again if you post, please refrain from debates in this thread.

Like Calvin, I'm just a Christian who believes the word of God.

No infant baptism; no loss of salvation.

 

[Theo1689]

So there are some that would consider themselves Calvinists and some Arminian.
Now from what I have been observing some Calvinists believe in infant baptism and some Arminian too.

.

	Calvinist​	Arminian​
Infant Baptism	Presbyterian	Anglican Episcopalian Lutheran Methodist
Believer's Baptism	Reformed Baptist	Baptist "Bible churches"

.

Also, from what I have been observing some who are Arminian believe saved person can lose their salvation.

Calvinists usually hold to the "5 Points of TULIP":
<T>otal Depravity
<U>nconditional Election
<L>imited Atonement
<I>rresistible grace
<P>erseverance (or "preservation") of the Saints.

Many Arminians likewise hold to Total Depravity and that one cannot lose their salvation. Those in the SBC ("Southern Baptist Convention") tend to believe in "once saved, always saved", which is different than perseverance of the Saints, as they beileve you can accept Christ as Saviour (and therefore not lose your salvation) but don't have to accept him as "Lord". Their position has been disparagingly described as having a "license to sin".

As a general rule, we believe the Arminian vs. Calvinist debate to be an "in-house" debate, and generally believe both sides are saved. (We don't believe "only Calvinists are saved". We beileve "only the elect are saved", but we agree that non-Calvinist Christians are among the elect.). Unfortunately, there are some Arminians who try to kick Calvinists out of the kingdom of God.

Do you consider yourselves Calvinists or Arminian or do you consider yourself something else?

I'm a Reformed Baptist, holding to the 1689 London Baptist Confession of Faith.

Do you believe that infant baptism is required for salvation?

Infant baptism is simply getting a baby wet.

Do you believe that a saved person can lose their salvation?

John 10:28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.

Luke 15 also teaches that if any one of the sheep go astray, the Shepherd leaves the 99, and goes after the wayward sheep until He finds it, and brings it back into the fold.

I am just Christian and believe the word of God. I know that the name can mean anything today.

Yes, I am a Christian as well.
I sometimes refer to myself as a 'Calvinist", not because I follow Calvin (I don't), but because that is a very precise label that conveys a GREAT deal of information about what I believe in 3 little syllables.

I do not believe that infant baptism is Biblical or that water baptism or infant baptism is require or helps in salvation.

Infant baptism is simply getting a baby wet. I was baptized at 6 mos. in my mom's Anglican church, but was truly baptized after I accepted the gospel at age 27.

Baptism is something that is commanded of us, but not as a "requirement" for salvation, but something we do BECAUSE we are saved. It is a proclamation of our faith.

And again if you post, please refrain from debates in this thread.

I hope you found the above helpful.

 

[Theo1689]

Like Calvin, I'm just a Christian who believes the word of God.

No infant baptism; no loss of salvation.

Wow, you make me feel verbose by comparson.
Thanks a LOT!

 

[Yodas_Prodigy]

Calvinist. I understand why mature Arminians hold to their system.
The believer is preserved by YHWH.
I hold to Believer's Baptism. I do understand why certain Christians hold to that teaching.
Like Theo, 1689 London Baptist Confession is a guide for me

 

[Yodas_Prodigy]

I'm a Reformed Baptist, holding to the 1689 London Baptist Confession of Faith.

I knew there were more reasons why I like you... Just found another

 

[Theo1689]

Calvinist. I understand why mature Arminians hold to their system.
The believer is preserved by YHWH.
I hold to Believer's Baptism. I do understand why certain Christians hold to that teaching.
Like Theo, 1689 London Baptist Confession is a guide for me

Yep... I recently heard a saying:
"If you're 20 and not a Democrat, you have no heart.
If you're 40 and not a Republican, you have no brain."
So we understand why each group believes as they do, even if we disagree with it.
And I believe the above saying is true, especially after seeing so many POC's leaving the Democratic party after watching Biden destroy their nation.

I believe there is also a progression from Arminian to Calvinist, as the believer matures and better understands the Scriptures. (And yes, I understand that some change the other way as well.)

 

[Yodas_Prodigy]

Yep... I recently heard a saying:
"If you're 20 and not a Democrat, you have no heart.
If you're 40 and not a Republican, you have no brain."
So we understand why each group believes as they do, even if we disagree with it.
And I believe the above saying is true, especially after seeing so many POC's leaving the Democratic party after watching Biden destroy their nation.

I believe there is also a progression from Arminian to Calvinist, as the believer matures and better understands the Scriptures. (And yes, I understand that some change the other way as well.)

I have been amazed at how many closet Calvinists there are... I found a some over the last years that surprised me...

 

[Kampioen]

So there are some that would consider themselves Calvinists and some Arminian.
Now from what I have been observing some Calvinists believe in infant baptism and some Arminian too.
Also, from what I have been observing some who are Arminian believe saved person can lose their salvation.
So if some members would please post the following information.

Do you consider yourselves Calvinists or Arminian or do you consider yourself something else?
Do you believe that infant baptism is required for salvation?
Do you believe that a saved person can lose their salvation?

I am just Christian and believe the word of God. I know that the name can mean anything today.
I do not believe that infant baptism is Biblical or that water baptism or infant baptism is require or helps in salvation.
I do not believe that a saved person can lose salvation. Once saved by the Lord Jesus Christ always saved by the Lord Jesus Christ.

And again if you post, please refrain from debates in this thread.

If it's between Calvinism and Arminianism I would say Arminian for convenience, by which I mean non-Calvinist. Of course just a Christian actually.

I believe in believers baptism but not to obtain salvation.

I believe a person perhaps can lose his salvation but not casually, even if he backslides a lot or deeply or even dies that way. He can always come back. God keeps convicting him. But if he does loose his salvation he won't get it back. Christ only died once. He won't die again. Of course there's always the case where he never did get saved.

 

[fltom]

Yep... I recently heard a saying:
"If you're 20 and not a Democrat, you have no heart.
If you're 40 and not a Republican, you have no brain."
So we understand why each group believes as they do, even if we disagree with it.
And I believe the above saying is true, especially after seeing so many POC's leaving the Democratic party after watching Biden destroy their nation.

I believe there is also a progression from Arminian to Calvinist, as the believer matures and better understands the Scriptures. (And yes, I understand that some change the other way as well.)

Actually Arminianism came about by Calvinists who found fault with Calvinism.

 

[puddleglum]

I believe that Calvinism is closest to Biblical truth but I am not sure it is completely true. I suspect that there is a higher truth than either Calvinism or Arminianism but we won't be able to comprehend that truth during this life, so I will just go on being a Calvinism.

I believe that the correct form of baptism is immersion in water by someone who has been saved by faith in Jesus Christ. Baptism is a practice that should follow salvation but you can't be saved by it.

Salvation is a gift of God and the Bible says that the gifts of God are irrevocable. You cannot lose your salvation. There are many who believe they are saved when they are not. If such a person stops claiming to be a Christian it may appear to others that he has lost his salvation when in fact he was never saved.

 

[SavedByTheLord]

I believe that Calvinism is closest to Biblical truth but I am not sure it is completely true. I suspect that there is a higher truth than either Calvinism or Arminianism but we won't be able to comprehend that truth during this life, so I will just go on being a Calvinism.

I believe that the correct form of baptism is immersion in water by someone who has been saved by faith in Jesus Christ. Baptism is a practice that should follow salvation but you can't be saved by it.

Salvation is a gift of God and the Bible says that the gifts of God are irrevocable. You cannot lose your salvation. There are many who believe they are saved when they are not. If such a person stops claiming to be a Christian it may appear to others that he has lost his salvation when in fact he was never saved.

Thanks.

 

[Nic]

.

	Calvinist​	Arminian​
Infant Baptism	Presbyterian	Anglican Episcopalian Lutheran Methodist
Believer's Baptism	Reformed Baptist	Baptist "Bible churches"

.



Calvinists usually hold to the "5 Points of TULIP":
<T>otal Depravity
<U>nconditional Election
<L>imited Atonement
<I>rresistible grace
<P>erseverance (or "preservation") of the Saints.

Many Arminians likewise hold to Total Depravity and that one cannot lose their salvation. Those in the SBC ("Southern Baptist Convention") tend to believe in "once saved, always saved", which is different than perseverance of the Saints, as they beileve you can accept Christ as Saviour (and therefore not lose your salvation) but don't have to accept him as "Lord". Their position has been disparagingly described as having a "license to sin".

As a general rule, we believe the Arminian vs. Calvinist debate to be an "in-house" debate, and generally believe both sides are saved. (We don't believe "only Calvinists are saved". We beileve "only the elect are saved", but we agree that non-Calvinist Christians are among the elect.). Unfortunately, there are some Arminians who try to kick Calvinists out of the kingdom of God.



I'm a Reformed Baptist, holding to the 1689 London Baptist Confession of Faith.



Infant baptism is simply getting a baby wet.



John 10:28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.

Luke 15 also teaches that if any one of the sheep go astray, the Shepherd leaves the 99, and goes after the wayward sheep until He finds it, and brings it back into the fold.



Yes, I am a Christian as well.
I sometimes refer to myself as a 'Calvinist", not because I follow Calvin (I don't), but because that is a very precise label that conveys a GREAT deal of information about what I believe in 3 little syllables.



Infant baptism is simply getting a baby wet. I was baptized at 6 mos. in my mom's Anglican church, but was truly baptized after I accepted the gospel at age 27.

Baptism is something that is commanded of us, but not as a "requirement" for salvation, but something we do BECAUSE we are saved. It is a proclamation of our faith.



I hope you found the above helpful.

I'm not sure what qualifies as an Arminian and perhaps some contemporary Lutherans or LINO may well be, but historically Lutherans are strict monergists as am I.
Does that make historic Lutherans Arminian? I would not think so.
That's all I wanted to address from what I noticed in the chart.
Thank you.

 

[Theo1689]

I'm not sure what qualifies as an Arminian and perhaps some contemporary Lutherans or LINO may well be, but historically Lutherans are strict monergists as am I.
Does that make historic Lutherans Arminian? I would not think so.

Admittedly, I don't know much about current Luthern theology. Obviously Martin Luther is an important character in the Protestant Reformation, but my understanding is that Lutheran theology reverted back to Melanchthonianism after Luther's death.

If "free will" is an important doctrine in Lutheranism, that would lean towards Arminianism.

 

[Nic]

Admittedly, I don't know much about current Luthern theology. Obviously Martin Luther is an important character in the Protestant Reformation, but my understanding is that Lutheran theology reverted back to Melanchthonianism after Luther's death.

If "free will" is an important doctrine in Lutheranism, that would lean towards Arminianism.

Lutheran view of free will, free in things lowly (earthly); where to live, what to eat, whom to marry, etc.
Not free in things heavenly. Men are passive in salvation and justification. They can do nothing to choose God nor save themselves. Salvation happens outside of us!

I had one other reformed fellow mention this idea of Melanchthonianism but he never offered a source. He was repeatedly asked and challenged but nothing. Would you have a source for the comment? Thank you!

 

[Yodas_Prodigy]

Lutheran view of free will, free in things lowly (earthly); where to live, what to eat, whom to marry, etc.
Not free in things heavenly. Men are passive in salvation and justification. They can do nothing to choose God nor save themselves. Salvation happens outside of us!

I had one other reformed fellow mention this idea of Melanchthonianism but he never offered a source. He was repeatedly asked and challenged but nothing. Would you have a source for the comment? Thank you!

RC Sproul would mention Melanchthon in passing when discussing Calvinism and Martin Luther/Lutheranism.

 

[Theo1689]

I had one other reformed fellow mention this idea of Melanchthonianism but he never offered a source. He was repeatedly asked and challenged but nothing. Would you have a source for the comment? Thank you!

It was many years ago, and I didn't go around citing sources for everything I read or watched.

Sorry.

I tried Googling it, and only found one hit, but it wouldn't load.

 

[Nic]

It was many years ago, and I didn't go around citing sources for everything I read or watched.

Sorry.

I tried Googling it, and only found one hit, but it wouldn't load.

Ok np. I just wanted to read what was said. As far as googling, I'll try that again. I once saw something close in a textbook but I wasn't sure if that was the source. Thanks again.

 

[Nic]

RC Sproul would mention Melanchthon in passing when discussing Calvinism and Martin Luther/Lutheranism.

Thanks. What's odd about the comment at least in one context, is that Melanchthon was viewed at some point earlier as a crypto-calvinist.

 

[Tertiumquid]

Thanks. What's odd about the comment at least in one context, is that Melanchthon was viewed at some point earlier as a crypto-calvinist.

I'm not exactly sure what is being discussed here about Melanchton... but... in regard to Sproul, if one listens or reads anything by Sproul's mentor, John Gerstner, one will realize how much influence Gerstner had on Sproul. I've found a few instances over the years in which some popular quote from Sproul actually originated from Gerstner.

See for instance, the Ligonier produced series of Dr. Gerstner discussing church history. This Gerstner video is specific to Luther / Melanchthon, and the way in which Luther / Melanchthon differed on predestination. Gerstner claims, in essence, that Melanchthon differed with Luther on predestination, and waited until Luther died to fully express his difference. Gerstner claims Melanchthon reverted to a "subtle form" of synergism after Luther's death. Whether one agrees with Gerstner or not on his overview, one point he does bring up is the whether or not Luther changed his view on predestination later in his life (differing from his earlier book The Bondage of the Will). I would agree with Gerstner that he did not... though specifically adding that Luther was not a 5-point Calvinist, differing with the Reformed on the extent of the atonement and the perseverance of the saints.

The "Melancthon is a crypto-Calvinist" charge is in regard to the Lord's Supper.

From a Lutheran perspective, an interesting overview of inter-Lutheran squabbles after Luther's death can be found in Robert Kolb's book, Martin Luther as Prophet, Teacher, and Hero.