Magic Stone, Folk Magic. For Markk

Richard7 said:
Yes Markk, I think you are not listening, I stated I don't think its about the gay issue, maybe some but you have other doubts and issues.
Click to expand...
I didn't say you did...I did state that the Gay issue is a huge issue for the younger saints according to the survey, which is just a fact...it had nothing to do with me.

Ralf If I had to sum up why I left, I would simply frame it as I was sold a bag of lies, and there are issues with just about every aspect, history, or doctrine of the church.
 
Richard7 said:
Chuckle 1 and 2 again Markk... one is revisionist and progressive, The New Mormonism and 2 is about the gay issue toned down by John as social issues.... I guess you just don't pay attention...
Click to expand...

Read it, page 15...for younger people it is the LGBT issue. These people surveyed are members. If this is the # 1 concern of the younger generation, how will it assimilate into the church in the future. Please focus and stay on topic.
 
Richard7 said:
So you disagree on the Gay issue as not being a huge social issure for the Church? And possibly first or second to that is The New Mormonism? chuckle.
Click to expand...
Ralf, read the survey. Read what I wrote.

FYI...the survey is broken down in several ways and demographics...as an example for you folks the LGBT/Prop 8 was the largest issue, for molder generations and men the BoA...for women, polygamy and the church's stance on women.

Further, it was this survey and the Swedish apostasy that helped to force the church produce the essays.
 
Markk said:
I didn't say you did...I did state that the Gay issue is a huge issue for the younger saints according to the survey, which is just a fact...it had nothing to do with me.

Ralf If I had to sum up why I left, I would simply frame it as I was sold a bag of lies, and there are issues with just about every aspect, history, or doctrine of the church.
Click to expand...
Well a lot of those issues we have debated and I have shown how you have been played and sucked in to believing the lies of the enemies of the Church. I bet you even today have doubts which I have been instrumential in at least making you think... hmm
 
Markk said:

Read it, page 15...for younger people it is the LGBT issue. These people surveyed are members. If this is the # 1 concern of the younger generation, how will it assimilate into the church in the future. Please focus and stay on topic.
Click to expand...
Good question, how is this being assimilated by members. This of course is a huge issue made even bigger by our Government, Media and our Schools. Well its not going very well for Bud Light, Disney, Target and many other woke coportations. As like most issues of this nature, this too will come to a end. In the mean time we will lose members and many of our youth. Why should the Church Doctrine need to change, why should we agree with the seular world, why in the Bible and Book of Mormon we see people who become very righteous and after a few years cave to the temptaion of Satan? Not to worry Markk, God wins in the end.
 
Markk said:
Ralf, read the survey. Read what I wrote.

FYI...the survey is broken down in several ways and demographics...as an example for you folks the LGBT/Prop 8 was the largest issue, for molder generations and men the BoA...for women, polygamy and the church's stance on women.

Further, it was this survey and the Swedish apostasy that helped to force the church produce the essays.
Click to expand...
How does any survey going to affect the truth? You can survey to hell freezes over and it stilll will not affect our Dotrine. We may make enemies both with existing members and the youth, but that is a choice they will have to make just as you did...
 
Richard7 said:
How does any survey going to affect the truth? You can survey to hell freezes over and it stilll will not affect our Dotrine. We may make enemies both with existing members and the youth, but that is a choice they will have to make just as you did...
Click to expand...
Focus, the survey is simple...it asks TBMs, or former TBMs, why they are struggling, or have struggled with the church.

No one asked you or is implying, how surveys affect what people believe, that is just a non sequitur and a straw-man. The survey reflects why the struggled and doubted. If you believe the reasons people struggle are not valid...then again, you are part of the issue as to why many are struggling.

So back to the survey, the #1 reasons young folks had issues with the church, was LBGT and prop 8. That is just the truth.

Do you want to address the issues in the survey or divert.
 
Richard7 said:
Good question, how is this being assimilated by members. This of course is a huge issue made even bigger by our Government, Media and our Schools. Well its not going very well for Bud Light, Disney, Target and many other woke coportations. As like most issues of this nature, this too will come to a end. In the mean time we will lose members and many of our youth. Why should the Church Doctrine need to change, why should we agree with the seular world, why in the Bible and Book of Mormon we see people who become very righteous and after a few years cave to the temptaion of Satan? Not to worry Markk, God wins in the end.
Click to expand...

We can see how it is assimilating HERE

You keep wanting to divert and ignore this an make it about me, when I am only pointing out how the church is changing. It is changing in becoming more liberal on issues like this, and it is changing in becoming more truthful with the history. There are also issue now with transparity with funds...so how this all works out will be interesting for sure.
 
Richard7 said:
Well a lot of those issues we have debated and I have shown how you have been played and sucked in to believing the lies of the enemies of the Church. I bet you even today have doubts which I have been instrumential in at least making you think... hmm
Click to expand...
Ralf, Members like Daniel O. McClellan, David Bokovoy, and Richard Bushman make me think, and allow me to examine new thought.

Ralf, you are scattered at best, almost impossible to keep focused, and 100% reactive, and do not research and study. What you offer is simple. I hope to show you, that there is life after Mormonism, and There is absolutely nothing Jesus did on the cross that, Mormonism can add to.

I care about you Ralf, and I pray for you.
 
Markk said:
Focus, the survey is simple...it asks TBMs, or former TBMs, why they are struggling, or have struggled with the church.

No one asked you or is implying, how surveys affect what people believe, that is just a non sequitur and a straw-man. The survey reflects why the struggled and doubted. If you believe the reasons people struggle are not valid...then again, you are part of the issue as to why many are struggling.

So back to the survey, the #1 reasons young folks had issues with the church, was LBGT and prop 8. That is just the truth.

Do you want to address the issues in the survey or divert.
Click to expand...
You absolutely misssed my point... you can defend the survey and explain how it works and why it works but it still does not reveal the truth of our doctine of marriage only between a man and a women and one must abide by the commandments of God to achieve celetial salvation. I gay person can belong to the kingdom of God but must be willing to abide by a man and a women only can be together, are only the way we can keep our covenants.

I love surveys markk, but they do not address Gods commandments and truths.
 
Markk said:
Ralf, Members like Daniel O. McClellan, David Bokovoy, and Richard Bushman make me think, and allow me to examine new thought.
Click to expand...
Yes and they are men with credentials but only have the voice of a man or women. Most likely good people who like you have been sucked into the lies of lucifer...



Markk said:
Ralf, you are scattered at best, almost impossible to keep focused, and 100% reactive, and do not research and study. What you offer is simple. I hope to show you, that there is life after Mormonism, and There is absolutely nothing Jesus did on the cross that, Mormonism can add to.
Click to expand...

Poison the well, chuckle.


Markk said:
I care about you Ralf, and I pray for you.
Click to expand...
Well, we could still be good friends.
 
Markk said:
We can see how it is assimilating HERE

You keep wanting to divert and ignore this an make it about me, when I am only pointing out how the church is changing. It is changing in becoming more liberal on issues like this, and it is changing in becoming more truthful with the history. There are also issue now with transparity with funds...so how this all works out will be interesting for sure.
Click to expand...
Yes, interesting for sure! Will the Kingdom of God cave into a more secular and earthly body of believers, or will the Church remain firm in its orthodox teachings. What do you mean transparity with funds, what does that mean and how does that work?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top