Meaning of John 6:43-44

[Newbirth]

That's blatantly wrong.

that is your opinion, not a defense of your position. The person in question does not agree with you...

Which because of the above - it isn't.

It is because the person in question does not agree with you.

It's neither... It's called experience.

in your imagination...

"Maybe" wasn't used to describe the fact that Stiggy has this constant problem that we all commonly experience, it was used to describe the accuracy of the terms used to describe it.

You are not making sense..."maybe" cannot describe anything accurately

Because you aren't around here enough to know.

Edit per mod.

 

[Whatsisface]

Then being an atheist is more than lacking a belief in God. My mind didn't change to belief in God by exposure to strong Christian arguments.It came about slowly by God answering a prayer of desperation. It turned to belief after I moved to England and met a girl who had a real experince with God which was something I had come to desire. I repented after reading the gospel of Matthew. I was baptized after reading Acts 2. i received the baptism of the Holy Spirit in my flat while praying with my friend. Eventually I found a church group with which to fellowship. The most difficult thing was resisting the bombardment of atheistic thoughts that what I was experiencing of God's presence wasn't real.

This is an example of the divide between Christians and atheists, in that you turned to God through desperation and wanting, and through this you found experiential reasons to believe. Psychologically this is hardly surprising.

Atheists don't see all this as good reasons to believe for numerous reasons. For example, there are Muslims who found Allah for much the same sorts of reasons as you found Jesus. If the experience of God shows the one true God and people find different Gods, then experiential reasons are not a reliable pathway to truth.

 

[5wize]

in your imagination...

Sounds like Christianity

I read the posts...You just exposed your ignorance. I can read posts all day without responding to any. Saying that I am not around enough is just silly..

So you read one thread and you now have a corner on the term "always"?

 

[stiggy wiggy]

This is an example of the divide between Christians and atheists, in that you turned to God through desperation and wanting, and through this you found experiential reasons to believe. Psychologically this is hardly surprising.

I agree. It's no more surprising than hearing that a starving man turned to food.

 

[5wize]

God did not call anyone to be a Christian, so what is your point?

God doesn't call anyone... so I guess there isn't one.

I never made that claim... I said I read the posts, I did not say I read one post.

You read one thread of posts... "always" is not an assessment you can make.

Obviously, you have a comprehension problem...

Only with you... excuse me if I don't bother to work that out.

 

[Caroljeen]

Maybe you can save it?

It's not worth it.

 

[Caroljeen]

This is an example of the divide between Christians and atheists, in that you turned to God through desperation and wanting, and through this you found experiential reasons to believe. Psychologically this is hardly surprising.

These divine experiences happened too often and usually unexpectedly for them to be "psychological".

Atheists don't see all this as good reasons to believe for numerous reasons. For example, there are Muslims who found Allah for much the same sorts of reasons as you found Jesus. If the experience of God shows the one true God and people find different Gods, then experiential reasons are not a reliable pathway to truth.

I was simply looking for God to answer my prayer. I didn't know it was the God of the Bible until months later when I landed in England.

 

[Whatsisface]

These divine experiences happened too often and usually unexpectedly for them to be "psychological".

Do they happen within yourself?

I was simply looking for God to answer my prayer. I didn't know it was the God of the Bible until months later when I landed in England.

This doesn't answer my point. There are people who think they experience the presence of God, but some say it's the Christian God, some say it's Allah, etc etc,. If the experience could tell you which God it is, you would all believe in the same God.

 

[Newbirth]

God doesn't call anyone... so I guess there isn't one.

Acts 2:39
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Romans 1:7
To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

You read one thread of posts... "always" is not an assessment you can make.

Are you telling me what I read? You cannot tell anyone what assessment they can or cannot make.

Only with you...

That does not change the fact that you have an understanding problem as you just admitted.

excuse me if I don't bother to work that out.

If you could have, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

 

[Caroljeen]

Do they happen within yourself?

Within myself and outside myself.

This doesn't answer my point. There are people who think they experience the presence of God, but some say it's the Christian God, some say it's Allah, etc etc,. If the experience could tell you which God it is, you would all believe in the same God.

I've had an experience that let me know Jesus is God's name.

 

[5wize]

Acts 2:39
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Romans 1:7
To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

I don't believe in your sources. They are no good for life governance.

Are you telling me what I read? You cannot tell anyone what assessment they can or cannot make.

I read the same stuff, so yes I can.

That does not change the fact that you have an understanding problem as you just admitted.

Some lacks of understanding are blessings.

If you could have, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Or I could decide it's just not worth it. Notice I'm not asking you for any clarity? Get the hint?

 

[Whatsisface]

Within myself and outside myself.

Within could be ascribed to your psychology. What do you mean by outside yourself?

I've had an experience that let me know Jesus is God's name.

Hmm. So, what was that experience?

Muslims are just as convinced they have found Allah, as you are convinced you have found Jesus.

 

[Caroljeen]

OMG yes, totally different than CARM, although I will join others in saying that your conversation style here is really good, and I appreciate it.

I finished watching your conversation. I hate to call it a debate because it was so respectful on both sides. It was a pleasure to watch it.
After watching it, I reaffirm my assertion that a Christian cannot give the evidence that would convert you. Only Christ can do that.
Do you think science can explain every thing?

 

[5wize]

what you believe or don't believe is up to you...

That is an assumption therefore you cannot.

says the fool in his folly...

says the fool in his folly...

For not wanting to banter uselessly with you?

 

[The Pixie]

This doesn't answer my point. There are people who think they experience the presence of God, but some say it's the Christian God, some say it's Allah, etc etc,. If the experience could tell you which God it is, you would all believe in the same God.

And nearly every time it is the God of the religion they were raised in as kids that they find, whether that religion was Christianity, Islam or whatever.

 

[stiggy wiggy]

And nearly every time it is the God of the religion they were raised in as kids that they find, whether that religion was Christianity, Islam or whatever.

So? The Providential Hand of God is involved in where we are born and raised. God blesses Christian parents with kids and they are thus more likely to be raised in the ways of the Lord. It's not exactly like you uncovered some big scandal or something.

 

[Furion]

And nearly every time it is the God of the religion they were raised in as kids that they find, whether that religion was Christianity, Islam or whatever.

God is above your "christianity"

For instance there were many men and groups of men who God interacted with apart from Israel, there are likely more believers in China than people in America. China is not known for its christian tradition, silly.

You can't hobble God into a church building, a religious sect or even in your secular hellscape.

He is above all and not worried about the box you attempt to keep Him.

 

[5wize]

God is above your "christianity"

For instance there were many men and groups of men who God interacted with apart from Israel, there are likely more believers in China than people in America. China is not known for its christian tradition, silly.

Where is their written testimony and tradition of this?

You can't hobble God into a church building, a religious sect or even in your secular hellscape.

He is above all and not worried about the box you attempt to keep Him.

Then why do you with your "Christianity"?

 

[Whatsisface]

And nearly every time it is the God of the religion they were raised in as kids that they find, whether that religion was Christianity, Islam or whatever.

Yes, exactly.

 

[Furion]

Where is their written testimony and tradition of this?

In scripture for one. Look up Melchizedek or the midianites, and others. In fact the Lord may say to some here what He told Jonah:

Jonah 4
10 But the Lord said, “You have been concerned about this plant, though you did not tend it or make it grow. It sprang up overnight and died overnight. 11 And should I not have concern for the great city of Nineveh, in which there are more than a hundred and twenty thousand people who cannot tell their right hand from their left—and also many animals?

The Lord is as acquainted with you as much as me.

He is acquainted and concerned with every single human. He doesn't need me to get to you.

Then why do you with your "Christianity"?

Christianity is the world's description of what it doesn't understand.

There is the church of God, and there are those not in the church of God.

The Lord didn't direct the Roman Catholics to create the Holy Roman Empire, tell Calvin to take over Geneva, or any number of things throughout history.

You can even prove this for yourself. Examine the scriptures, like a noble Berean, and tell me what you claim the church of God should be doing, according to God.