No real difference between compatibalism and hard determinism.

Sketo said:
Please explain…
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In compatibilism all your desires are determined by God so you can only do what God determined your desires to be

You do what you want

but your wanter can only want what your determined desires allow it to want
 
fltom said:
In compatibilism all your desires are determined by God so you can only do what God determined your desires to be
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Not true. Hypothetically you could do what you don’t want to do if you wanted to do it. Physically there is nothing holding you back from doing what you don’t want to do.

This would be like me arguing against your view by saying you can only do what God “allows” you to do.

It’s not an argument with any substance.

fltom said:
You do what you want
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Correct!

fltom said:
but your wanter can only want what your determined desires allow it to want
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“your determined desires allow it to want…”

??? desires ??‍♂️ want ???

Your not making sense fltom. You seem to be trying to manufacture a problem where there is no problem.

You simply do what you want… and God determined that you want to do it.
 
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Sketo said:
Not true. Hypothetically you could do what you don’t want to do if you wanted to do it. Physically there is nothing holding you back from doing what you don’t want to do.
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Sorry but you do not know what you are talking about

In compatibilism God determines your desires and you can only do what is your greatest desire



Compatibilism (also known as soft determinism), is the belief that God's predetermination and meticulous providence is "compatible" with voluntary choice. In light of Scripture, human choices are believed to be exercised voluntarily but the desires and circumstances that bring about these choices about occur through divine determinism (see Acts 2:23 & 4:27-28). It should be noted that this position is no less deterministic than hard determinism - be clear that neither soft nor hard determinism believes man has a free will. Our choices are only our choices because they are voluntary, not coerced. We do not make choices contrary to our desires or natures. Compatibilism is directly contrary to libertarian free will. Therefore voluntary choice is not the freedom to choose otherwise, that is, without any influence, prior prejudice, inclination, or disposition. Voluntary does mean, however, the ability to choose what we want or desire most. The former view is known as contrary choice, the latter free agency. (Note: compatibilism denies that the will is free to choose otherwise, that is, free from the bondage of the corruption nature,for the unregenerate, and denies that the will is free from God's eternal decreee.) Compatibilism | Monergism
 
David1701 said:
No; Compatibilism teaches that man always does what he wants the most and that God does not force him against his will.
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Ok. I suspect though most all Christians that call themselves determinists are really compatibilists, they just might not be familiar with the term.
But if you ask them do men do what they want to do most they would agree.
 
Sketo said:
you could do what you don’t want to do if you wanted to do it. Physically there is nothing holding you back from doing what you don’t want to do.
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This sounds like what Paul says when he observes that what he wants to do, he doesn't do, and what he doesn't want to do ends up being what he does. He's referring to the inadequacy of his own will power, and the ultimate message is that he isn't free to do what he wants at all. He's in bondage.
Sketo said:
This would be like me arguing against your view by saying you can only do what God “allows” you to do.

It’s not an argument with any substance.
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If that's the case, then what effective difference is there between that and what you say below?
Sketo said:
You simply do what you want… and God determined that you want to do it.
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Simpletruther said:
Ok. I suspect though most all Christians that call themselves determinists are really compatibilists, they just might not be familiar with the term.
But if you ask them do men do what they want to do most they would agree.
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That's possible; although I have not had the opportunity to test it.
 
Sketo said:
How is that different then your Dualistic view stating God determined to “allow” what he wants? He still determined what he wants.
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still you have not corrected your error?

You misuse the term dualism

ignoring definition and fact

and Again for the third time did Satan rebel against God
 
Sketo said:
Exactly!



In that Storyline Level reference Yes!

Your turn, Did Satan “rebel against God” by an Ultimate “opposing power” separate from God?
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So how can you appeal to the context of the reference I gave

Does not make sense

fltom said:
So Satan did not lead many of the angels astray?
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In that Storyline Level reference Yes!

Storyline?

That appears to be your way of denying what is stated

Are you saying Satan did not really rebel by leading angels from God?

Satan is not equal to God and he is not an ultimate opposing power in my view

But there is logical reason you can can deny it if you hold men operating according to the power given them by God
posits dualism





bnio
 
fltom said:
But there is logical reason you can can deny it if you hold men operating according to the power given them by God
posits dualism
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Is God in control of ALL of his own power… or is he less than Omnipotent?
 
Sketo said:
Is God in control of ALL of his own power… or is he less than Omnipotent?
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Are you claiming God is impotent to grant a measure of power and allow the exercise of that power within limits he established
 
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