Old Earth Creationism

[inertia]

You will never exegete the author’s intent if he was using symbols, poetry, or allegory that held a specific meaning in the culture or time the author wrote. Knowing what the author’s peers or subsequent audience thought it meant would be a good place to start, IMO. For example, what did it mean to the Essenes, Pharisees, or Sadducees around 200 BC? —should carry more weight than either you or I sitting at a desk and applying reason alone to the text.

Never - is a strong word. We can grasp their ancient understanding of the universe as intended for their audience in their time. Although ancient Hebrew people had an incorrect physical idea, as understanding increased, the merism "the heavens and the Earth" is now understood as the entire universe as we understand it today.

What if it has nothing to do with natural phenomena? What if the first chapter of Genesis is about a spiritual process occurring inside humans, —a soul process?

^That^ premise would be difficult to defend based on the context of the narrative.

Then I am not sure that employing natural science, logic, mathematics, and linguistics is going to give you the intended meaning. You are applying brute rationality to an allegory about the rising (and descending) Christ.

I'm convinced that Genesis 1: 2-5 is consistent with our current understanding that Earth was once a water covered world, gradually thinning clouds and discernable solar illumination on planet Earth.

We have Paul relating the narrative to Christ and his church.
”Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh (1).” This mystery is profound, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church.” (Eph 5:31)

This scripture is important, but it isn't related to old earth creationism.

That is another reason to ask, what did it mean to the earliest Jews, and before them, to the Chaldeans, who taught about the first Adam. Jews were exiled in Babylonia arguably when the creation myths were written and some scholars see parallels in Hebrew themes with Chaldean religion, for example, the epic of Gilgamesh in Babylonian lore was reworked into Noah’s flood.

Ancient Near East religions with gods that hated other gods are not included in topics that concern old earth creationism.
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[inertia]

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The Bible teaches young earth. It does not teach old earth. That is understanding. What you are supporting is old earth mythology which is not understanding.

Where does the Bible teach young earth?

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[Harry Leggs]

Never - is a strong word. We can grasp their ancient understanding of the universe as intended for their audience in their time. Although ancient Hebrew people had an incorrect physical idea, as understanding increased, the merism "the heavens and the Earth" is now understood as the entire universe as we understand it today.

No corroboration. What you have here is what hostiles believed they understood. You do not know what they knew.

I'm convinced that Genesis 1: 2-5 is consistent with our current understanding that Earth was once a water covered world, gradually thinning clouds and discernable solar illumination on planet Earth.

Opinion absent one shred of supporting evidence.

Where does the Bible teach young earth?

Young Earth from the Bible was always the historical understanding until Lyell and even then its appeal was to Bible rejecters. Like i wrote before. You got nothing but distortions and wrong interpretations. On top of that, you ignore valid questions put to you. Young and Old Earth is fast becoming a line of demarcation between heretics and believers.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

Where does the Bible teach young earth?

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Where does the Bible teach gradualism?
Evolutionism?

GOD created man. God doesn't need your failed manSplaining

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

Never - is a strong word. We can grasp their ancient understanding of the universe as intended for their audience in their time. Although ancient Hebrew people had an incorrect physical idea, as understanding increased, the merism "the heavens and the Earth" is now understood as the entire universe as we understand it today.

^That^ premise would be difficult to defend based on the context of the narrative.



I'm convinced that Genesis 1: 2-5 is consistent with our current understanding that Earth was once a water covered world, gradually thinning clouds and discernable solar illumination on planet Earth.



This scripture is important, but it isn't related to old earth creationism.



Ancient Near East religions with gods that hated other gods are not included in topics that concern old earth creationism.
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More word salad.

Darwinism fails.

Your so called "Understandings" told us Mike Mannn had a Nobel Peace prize.

You are on the record of falling for conspiracy theories.

 

[Temujin]

Where does the Bible teach gradualism?
Evolutionism?

GOD created man. God doesn't need your failed manSplaining

Then let God come and explain. Why leave it to you? Or do you think that you are God?

 

[inertia]

...
Opinion absent one shred of supporting evidence.

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Based on your expressed point-of-view, it's evident that the Hebrew bible as it was written in Hebrew and our increasingly better understanding of the physical universe and ancient language isn't a factor worth considering.

The topic is not about an unsupported opinion that hasn't been vetted by experts in a variety of fields. It's about well-understood, reliable understanding as it exists today. It's clear, for example, that the concept of Earth orbiting our host star in space was unknown to ancient Hebrew people. Yet, the fundamental concept of a water covered world that was uninhabitable for human life as expressed in Genesis 1:2 -thousands of years ago- continues to inspire people with vastly different knowledge and experiences. We now have physical evidence of this truth. That alone, is evidence of an extraordinary God-inspired document worth studying.

Genesis 1:1 is an independent completed event - Creation Ex Nihilo. The beginning doesn't start at Genesis 1:2 with matter already available.

Biblical support:

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was fully God. The Word was with God in the beginning. All things were created by him, and apart from him not one thing was created that has been created." (John 1:1-3)

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[Authentic Nouveau]

Where does the Bible teach young earth?

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Where does it teach Darwinism?

No corroboration. What you have here is what hostiles believed they understood. You do not know what they knew.

Opinion absent one shred of supporting evidence.

Young Earth from the Bible was always the historical understanding until Lyell and even then its appeal was to Bible rejecters. Like i wrote before. You got nothing but distortions and wrong interpretations.

I might start a thread with comments on why Darwin was mad at God

On top of that, you ignore valid questions put to you.

Right there is a marker when they have big holes in their stories and myths.

Young and Old Earth is fast becoming a line of demarcation between heretics and believers.

Good point.
It is an expression of rebellion against God's authority.

God didn't devot time to explaining. No need.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

Then let God come and explain. Why leave it to you? Or do you think that you are God?

God doesn't owe you an explanation.
You have NO authority.
If there is NOGOD, why are you spending so many hours on pushback? Not a rational look on your part.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

What is old earth Creationism?

“Creationism” is commonly understood as God performing divine acts of creation as literally described in the Bible. So what have you done but implied the Bible literally happened a long time ago. How long ago? A million years ago, a billion years ago, four billion, 14 billion years ago? What are you asking? And compared to what? to natural mechanisms? Are you excluding natural mechanisms in old earth creationism?

According to your pet myths.

Exodus 20

King James Version

​

20 And God spake all these words, saying,
2 I am the Lord thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;
6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
7 Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

g

Old earth is alien to the Bible. You are calling God and Jesus liars.

Of course that is orthodox Darwinism.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

Was there animal death prior to the fall of Adam? Yes or no. One simple question and you will probably punk out.

One of the markers expressed so many ways is when they offer no answers and no details.
They do a Biden and run from questions.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

How is it more historical than allegorical?
You need to prove history and you need to do that from the text.

Is your family genealogy with names and ages allegory?

Mine isn't.
You need to prove.
Science requires observation and you have none.

We know you have none.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

They should explain the allegory of no death before the fall.

Science calls for observations.

 

[Tiburon]

More lies. You all depend on atheistic interpretations where the Bible is ignored and the timeline keeps changing. At the time of Darwin, it was millions of years and now it is billions. Let me ask you this.

Was there animal death prior to the fall of Adam? Yes or no. One simple question and you will probably punk out.

There was death. Thus the tree of life.

 

[inertia]

Where does it teach Darwinism?
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The Bible and Old Earth Creationism do not teach Darwinism.

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[Tiburon]

Is your family genealogy with names and ages allegory?

Mine isn't.
You need to prove.
Science requires observation and you have none.

We know you have none.

You do realise that Genesis is an amalgam of oral traditions. It's not a strict genealogy father to son but tribe to tribe.
Science requires observation and you have none. luckily the Bible isn't science.

 

[En Hakkore]

Genesis 1:1 is an independent completed event - Creation Ex Nihilo. The beginning doesn't start at Genesis 1:2 with matter already available.

How's your Hebrew coming along? Are you at a stage yet where we can discuss the finer points of grammar and syntax in the Genesis text?

Kind regards,
Jonathan

 

[CrowCross]

The Bible and Old Earth Creationism do not teach Darwinism.

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What does OEC teach?

 

[DaGeo]

What's incorrect about Old Earth Creationism? ( your best argument(s) please )

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It’s false, it is anti-biblical, it calls God a liar by disputing God’s own 6 day eyewitness account of creation and it is UNscientific

It also violates common sense literary rules of interpretation and violates the principles and guidelines of biblical hermeneutics

AND WORSE yet, it’s a compromising demonic doctrine that legitimizes eisegetical caprice