Time To Grow Up. There Is No Greater Purpose.

Silliness. Mass estimations are enough to identify a nuclear core.

To be "practical" in abiogenesis requires recreation of the environment.
Why? You are setting a "requirement" which cannot be met, which is the only reason that you are "requiring" it. It is a "requirement" in the sense that it the only way that non-naturally occuring abiogenesis gets a look in. If/when life is found on Europa or one of the other Jovian moons, natural abiogenesis will be proved. The precise manner on which it first occurred on earth is something that we may never know. That doesn't make it impossible, or even unlikely.
 
Why? You are setting a "requirement" which cannot be met, which is the only reason that you are "requiring" it. It is a "requirement" in the sense that it the only way that non-naturally occuring abiogenesis gets a look in.

Trying to fend off arguments I see.

No, what I described is what is required, a recreation of the environment.

I'm not "requiring" anything other than what the scientific method demands.

If/when life is found on Europa or one of the other Jovian moons, natural abiogenesis will be proved. The precise manner on which it first occurred on earth is something that we may never know. That doesn't make it impossible, or even unlikely.

Ya I hear your faith but I don't care about your faith, I care what is scientifically supported.

Since we both know experiments have failed in this, what is happening is you showing me your faith in a bio genesis event having happened, that's all. Your presuppositional arguments just assumes it.
 
How would that prove that life can emerge naturally from inanimate matter?
Because it would show that life has emerged independently in two places in the same solar system, showing that the emergence of life is relatively simple given the right conditions. Of course, it is also possible that a playful God created life on Europa on the eighth day, just for a laugh. That kind of silliness, as I have been saying for some time, is unfalsifiable.
 
Trying to fend off arguments I see.

No, what I described is what is required, a recreation of the environment.

I'm not "requiring" anything other than what the scientific method demands.



Ya I hear your faith but I don't care about your faith, I care what is scientifically supported.

Since we both know experiments have failed in this, what is happening is you showing me your faith in a bio genesis event having happened, that's all. Your presuppositional arguments just assumes it.
No, experiments have not failed in this. What experiments are you referring to? No experiment has attempted to recreate life. There have been plenty of experiments exploring the parameters within which it is possible that life was created. They have been, and continue to be successful.

What do you even mean by an experiment failing? A properly designed experiment reveals reality. Negative results do this as well as positive ones.That is never a failure
 
No, experiments have not failed in this. What experiments are you referring to? No experiment has attempted to recreate life. There have been plenty of experiments exploring the parameters within which it is possible that life was created. They have been, and continue to be successful.

What do you even mean by an experiment failing? A properly designed experiment reveals reality. Negative results do this as well as positive ones.That is never a failure

Yes, negative results.
 
"without repercussion"?? If I ever tried to use false evidence to support something I said on this board the christians would be all over me gleefully pointing out that I was "lying".

I am not attacking you. I'm attacking your "evidence" which is unreliable.

Which only proves you have no respect for the truth and every thing you say should be suspect.

Once again, if you provide "evidence" that is done by unqualified people, doesn't say what you claim it says, is not widely accepted as true, is unsupported or even proven false by other evidence; and people pointing this out is "bickering" then every thing you say should be suspect.

You refuse to say god exists. You admit no test proves god exists. That is good enough for me. I am not interested in discussing wether plants are making conscious decisions about how to live their lives. Thanks.
Yes, you can say things here without repercussions as long as you follow the rules. Someone here says you're lying, so what. You haven't lost your reputation, job, or anything else in real life. If you can't handle pushback then walk away.

I have no interest in arguments that attack persons, and that means other persons too, not just me. That is how juveniles argue in the schoolyard - “you're stupid so I don't care what you have to say” which often escalates into fistfights. A childish waste of time that evades but does not resolve arguments. Throw as many as you like but they all go to my trash.

If someone is really unqualified then you should be competent enough to take apart the arguments. When you addressed the argument, like when you pointed out the irreproducibility of the associative learning experiment, I took that seriously and responded as such. I was willing to concede Gagliano may be wrong. But notice how the NIH paper refuted her work without calling her unqualified or a kook or fraud. Being wrong in science is an expected part of the job and not definite proof for incompetence. So I just disproved your assumption that I have no respect for the truth.
 
Yes, you can say things here without repercussions as long as you follow the rules. Someone here says you're lying, so what. You haven't lost your reputation, job, or anything else in real life. If you can't handle pushback then walk away.

I have no interest in arguments that attack persons, and that means other persons too, not just me. That is how juveniles argue in the schoolyard - “you're stupid so I don't care what you have to say” which often escalates into fistfights. A childish waste of time that evades but does not resolve arguments. Throw as many as you like but they all go to my trash.

If someone is really unqualified then you should be competent enough to take apart the arguments. When you addressed the argument, like when you pointed out the irreproducibility of the associative learning experiment, I took that seriously and responded as such. I was willing to concede Gagliano may be wrong. But notice how the NIH paper refuted her work without calling her unqualified or a kook or fraud. Being wrong in science is an expected part of the job and not definite proof for incompetence. So I just disproved your assumption that I have no respect for the truth.
You walk away. You are the one whose skin is so thin you start crying whenever I merely question the validity of your evidence. If you provide 10 more examples of fake evidence I will attack those too. You confuse me questioning your evidence with me personally attacking you. I am a positive atheist posting arguments that god does not exist on a christian apologetics website. I don't need your advice on how to organize an argument nor how to be "competent enough". If you want to see a good brawl read the first 15 pages of "Hypostatic Union Is Impossible".

Your whole point has been extremely ambiguous throughout this thread. Few people have really challenged you because you seem to have no real point, other than implying that god exists. If you ever can think up some point that you can state affirmatively it is likely some christian or atheist will take issue with it. If you think me questioning your evidence is "not nice" wait until the christians decide you are contradicting their "book" and start explaining how you'll burn in hell.

You have not stated god exists. You agree there are no tests that prove god exists. That is good enough for me. I am not interested in having a discussion about wether a tomato plant is thinking about wether his next vacation should be to Cancun or Sanibel. Good luck.
 
You walk away. You are the one whose skin is so thin you start crying whenever I merely question the validity of your evidence. If you provide 10 more examples of fake evidence I will attack those too. You confuse me questioning your evidence with me personally attacking you. I am a positive atheist posting arguments that god does not exist on a christian apologetics website. I don't need your advice on how to organize an argument nor how to be "competent enough". If you want to see a good brawl read the first 15 pages of "Hypostatic Union Is Impossible".

Your whole point has been extremely ambiguous throughout this thread. Few people have really challenged you because you seem to have no real point, other than implying that god exists. If you ever can think up some point that you can state affirmatively it is likely some christian or atheist will take issue with it. If you think me questioning your evidence is "not nice" wait until the christians decide you are contradicting their "book" and start explaining how you'll burn in hell.

You have not stated god exists. You agree there are no tests that prove god exists. That is good enough for me. I am not interested in having a discussion about wether a tomato plant is thinking about wether his next vacation should be to Cancun or Sanibel. Good luck.
As I expected, you have no interest in discussion but are just looking for brawls. Since you are incapable of making sound arguments, all you do is attack and misrepresent people while disingenuously claiming to attack evidence.
 
As I expected, you have no interest in discussion but are just looking for brawls. Since you are incapable of making sound arguments, all you do is attack and misrepresent people while disingenuously claiming to attack evidence.

He is the new one around here.

I tried to warn him about going down the Carmatheist path of needless brawling but I think peer pressure is too much.
 
As I expected, you have no interest in discussion but are just looking for brawls. Since you are incapable of making sound arguments, all you do is attack and misrepresent people while disingenuously claiming to attack evidence.
What would we have a discussion about? You want to post false evidence and then discuss it as if it were real. Shall we discuss your unknown vague implications about things? In case you missed it this website is called Christian Apologetics & Research Ministry. This board is for debates about theism vs atheism. I suggest you take your Gagliano/Verney/Hoffman stuff to the general science board, maybe the people their won't check wether any of your evidence is actually real. Good luck.
 
He is the new one around here.

I tried to warn him about going down the Carmatheist path of needless brawling but I think peer pressure is too much.
A brawl is simply a topic that is hotly debated. I happen to like a good vociferous debate. If you don't, stay out of it and stop criticizing people who do. Maybe you and vbj can get together, wear suits, use words like "connoisseur", have tea and crumpets, and discuss the finer points of the consciousness of rocks.

Let the rest of us have fun.
 
A brawl is simply a topic that is hotly debated.

It has certain meaning to the believer anyway. Not so much to the people of the world.

I happen to like a good vociferous debate.

Lots of people of the world do, sure.

If you don't, stay out of it and stop criticizing people who do. Maybe you and vbj can get together, wear suits, use words like "connoisseur", have tea and crumpets, and discuss the finer points of the consciousness of rocks.

Oh hey, don't get ahead of yourself. My natural inclination is sorta mma. Natural inclinations are not always good and believers are just like you only they've learned from God a better way. Most believers might give a few chances and then dust someone off.

Let the rest of us have fun.

My main request is if you insult me do it with style and finesse.
 
It has certain meaning to the believer anyway. Not so much to the people of the world.



Lots of people of the world do, sure.



Oh hey, don't get ahead of yourself. My natural inclination is sorta mma. Natural inclinations are not always good and believers are just like you only they've learned from God a better way. Most believers might give a few chances and then dust someone off.



My main request is if you insult me do it with style and finesse.
My main request is if you insult me do it with style and finesse.
Apparently you are as thin skinned and frail as vbj. Someone merely disagreeing with you, you interpret as an insult. That is why I suggested you and he get together for tea and crumpets. Maybe you can put a vase of flowers on the table and say non-controversial things to each other.

Let the rest of us have fun without you and your delicate friend interfering.
 
Apparently you are as thin skinned and frail as vbj. Someone merely disagreeing with you, you interpret as an insult. That is why I suggested you and he get together for tea and crumpets. Maybe you can put a vase of flowers on the table and say non-controversial things to each other.

That's pretty good.

I tried a crumpet once, it was terrible.

Let the rest of us have fun without you and your delicate friend interfering.

Oh now that simply will not do. Who will you have to inform you? Are you asking all Christians to leave or just delicate ones? I'm not very delicate so..
 
That's pretty good.

I tried a crumpet once, it was terrible.



Oh now that simply will not do. Who will you have to inform you? Are you asking all Christians to leave or just delicate ones? I'm not very delicate so..
That's pretty good.
Thanks. I do the best I can.
I tried a crumpet once, it was terrible.
I don't like them either. Too dry.
Oh now that simply will not do. Who will you have to inform you? Are you asking all Christians to leave or just delicate ones? I'm not very delicate so..
Just the delicate ones. I'm going to have to ask you to watch what you say. What you are saying could conceivably, under certain circumstances, from certain points of view, be perceived as mildly controversial, and then someone is going to start whining again.
 
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