There is only one atonement, Tom.
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Some believe that God predestines all things. If that is so who killed Abel?
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In the old testament atonement was through levitical rituals.There is only one atonement, Tom.
Numbers 29:5 (KJV 1900) — 5 And one kid of the goats for a sin offering, to make an atonement for you:
Numbers 29:11 (KJV 1900) — 11 One kid of the goats for a sin offering; beside the sin offering of atonement, and the continual burnt offering, and the meat offering of it, and their drink offerings.
Numbers 31:50 (KJV 1900) — 50 We have therefore brought an oblation for the LORD, what every man hath gotten, of jewels of gold, chains, and bracelets, rings, earrings, and tablets, to make an atonement for our souls before the LORD.
etc
I am saying the levitical system did not involve the sacrifice of ChristWhat's the difference between OT and NT atonement? Are you saying tge day of atonement in the OT was not savific??
Not in the old covenantReally? What is the atonement for?
Was Christ's a offering and a sacrifice?
There is only one atonement, Tom.In the old testament atonement was through levitical rituals.
Heb 10:4 ... For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins ...Numbers 29:5 (KJV 1900) — 5 And one kid of the goats for a sin offering, to make an atonement for you:
Numbers 29:11 (KJV 1900) — 11 One kid of the goats for a sin offering; beside the sin offering of atonement, and the continual burnt offering, and the meat offering of it, and their drink offerings.
Numbers 31:50 (KJV 1900) — 50 We have therefore brought an oblation for the LORD, what every man hath gotten, of jewels of gold, chains, and bracelets, rings, earrings, and tablets, to make an atonement for our souls before the LORD.
etc
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Bible Search for atonementThere is only one atonement, Tom.
Heb 10:4 ... For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins ...
English Standard Version 90 results in 78 verses
Exod 29:33
They shall eat those things with which atonement was made at their ordination and consecration, but an outsider shall not eat of them, because they are holy.
Exod 29:36
and every day you shall offer a bull as a sin offering for atonement. Also you shall purify the altar, when you make atonement for it, and shall anoint it to consecrate it.
Exod 29:37
Seven days you shall make atonement for the altar and consecrate it, and the altar shall be most holy. Whatever touches the altar shall become holy.
Exod 30:10
Aaron shall make atonement on its horns once a year. With the blood of the sin offering of atonement he shall make atonement for it once in the year throughout your generations. It is most holy to the LORD.”
Exod 30:15
The rich shall not give more, and the poor shall not give less, than the half shekel, when you give the LORD’s offering to make atonement for your lives.
Exod 30:16
You shall take the atonement money from the people of Israel and shall give it for the service of the tent of meeting, that it may bring the people of Israel to remembrance before the LORD, so as to make atonement for your lives.”
Exod 32:30
The next day Moses said to the people, “You have sinned a great sin. And now I will go up to the LORD; perhaps I can make atonement for your sin.”
Lev 1:4
He shall lay his hand on the head of the burnt offering, and it shall be accepted for him to make atonement for him.
Lev 4:20
Thus shall he do with the bull. As he did with the bull of the sin offering, so shall he do with this. And the priest shall make atonement for them, and they shall be forgiven.
Lev 4:26
And all its fat he shall burn on the altar, like the fat of the sacrifice of peace offerings. So the priest shall make atonement for him for his sin, and he shall be forgiven.
Lev 4:31
And all its fat he shall remove, as the fat is removed from the peace offerings, and the priest shall burn it on the altar for a pleasing aroma to the LORD. And the priest shall make atonement for him, and he shall be forgiven.
Lev 4:35
And all its fat he shall remove as the fat of the lamb is removed from the sacrifice of peace offerings, and the priest shall burn it on the altar, on top of the LORD’s food offerings. And the priest shall make atonement for him for the sin which he has committed, and he shall be forgiven.
Lev 5:6
he shall bring to the LORD as his compensation for the sin that he has committed, a female from the flock, a lamb or a goat, for a sin offering. And the priest shall make atonement for him for his sin.
Lev 5:10
Then he shall offer the second for a burnt offering according to the rule. And the priest shall make atonement for him for the sin that he has committed, and he shall be forgiven.
Lev 5:13
Thus the priest shall make atonement for him for the sin which he has committed in any one of these things, and he shall be forgiven. And the remainder shall be for the priest, as in the grain offering.”
Lev 5:16
He shall also make restitution for what he has done amiss in the holy thing and shall add a fifth to it and give it to the priest. And the priest shall make atonement for him with the ram of the guilt offering, and he shall be forgiven.
Lev 5:18
He shall bring to the priest a ram without blemish out of the flock, or its equivalent, for a guilt offering, and the priest shall make atonement for him for the mistake that he made unintentionally, and he shall be forgiven.
Lev 6:7
And the priest shall make atonement for him before the LORD, and he shall be forgiven for any of the things that one may do and thereby become guilty.”
Lev 6:30
But no sin offering shall be eaten from which any blood is brought into the tent of meeting to make atonement in the Holy Place; it shall be burned up with fire.
Lev 7:7
The guilt offering is just like the sin offering; there is one law for them. The priest who makes atonement with it shall have it.
Lev 8:15
And he killed it, and Moses took the blood, and with his finger put it on the horns of the altar around it and purified the altar and poured out the blood at the base of the altar and consecrated it to make atonement for it.
Lev 8:34
As has been done today, the LORD has commanded to be done to make atonement for you.
Lev 9:7
Then Moses said to Aaron, “Draw near to the altar and offer your sin offering and your burnt offering and make atonement for yourself and for the people, and bring the offering of the people and make atonement for them, as the LORD has commanded.”
Lev 10:17
“Why have you not eaten the sin offering in the place of the sanctuary, since it is a thing most holy and has been given to you that you may bear the iniquity of the congregation, to make atonement for them before the LORD?
Lev 12:7
and he shall offer it before the LORD and make atonement for her. Then she shall be clean from the flow of her blood. This is the law for her who bears a child, either male or female.
Lev 12:8
And if she cannot afford a lamb, then she shall take two turtledoves or two pigeons, one for a burnt offering and the other for a sin offering. And the priest shall make atonement for her, and she shall be clean.”
Lev 14:18
And the rest of the oil that is in the priest’s hand he shall put on the head of him who is to be cleansed. Then the priest shall make atonement for him before the LORD.
Lev 14:19
The priest shall offer the sin offering, to make atonement for him who is to be cleansed from his uncleanness. And afterward he shall kill the burnt offering.
Lev 14:20
And the priest shall offer the burnt offering and the grain offering on the altar. Thus the priest shall make atonement for him, and he shall be clean.
Lev 14:21
“But if he is poor and cannot afford so much, then he shall take one male lamb for a guilt offering to be waved, to make atonement for him, and a tenth of an ephah of fine flour mixed with oil for a grain offering, and a log of oil;
Lev 14:29
And the rest of the oil that is in the priest’s hand he shall put on the head of him who is to be cleansed, to make atonement for him before the LORD.
Lev 14:31
one for a sin offering and the other for a burnt offering, along with a grain offering. And the priest shall make atonement before the LORD for him who is being cleansed.
Lev 14:53
And he shall let the live bird go out of the city into the open country. So he shall make atonement for the house, and it shall be clean.”
Lev 15:15
And the priest shall use them, one for a sin offering and the other for a burnt offering. And the priest shall make atonement for him before the LORD for his discharge.
Lev 15:30
And the priest shall use one for a sin offering and the other for a burnt offering. And the priest shall make atonement for her before the LORD for her unclean discharge.
Reformedguy
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It looked to Christ's offers and sacrifice.Not in the old covenant
Reformedguy
Well-known member
It did involve offering and sacrifice for sin and as the text points out there is no offering or sacrifice for sin for Eli and his progeny.I am saying the levitical system did not involve the sacrifice of Christ
Yes but Christ was not a part of itIt did involve offering and sacrifice for sin and as the text points out there is no offering or sacrifice for sin for Eli and his progeny.
Yes, but old covenant atonement still involved animal sacrifices and offeringsIt looked to Christ's offers and sacrifice.
Reformedguy
Well-known member
So. And they looked to the cross.Yes, but old covenant atonement still involved animal sacrifices and offerings
Reformedguy
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He is the fulfillment of what those offering and sacrifice foreshadowed. No one said He was actually involved. LolYes but Christ was not a part of it
Yes but again atonement in the Old Testament Levitical system was not a reference to the sacrifice ofHe is the fulfillment of what those offering and sacrifice foreshadowed. No one said He was actually involved. Lol
Christ
Reformedguy
Well-known member
It most certainly was. Christ came to fulfill the law. WOW.Yes but again atonement in the Old Testament Levitical system was not a reference to the sacrifice of
Christ
Yes, but again you cannot appeal to an anachronism.So. And they looked to the cross.
The reference would be to the Old Testament sacrificial system.
NopeIt most certainly was. Christ came to fulfill the law. WOW.
The Old Testament Levitical system is in view.
sacrifice or offering can refer only to the old covenant
As both sacrifice and offering are mentioned as distinctive means of atonement
Reformedguy
Well-known member
The old covenant foreshadowed the new. Which Christ came to fulfill not do away with.Nope
The Old Testament Levitical system is in view.
sacrifice or offering can refer only to the old covenant
As both sacrifice and offering are mentioned as distinctive means of atonement
You have no idea what you are talking about.
Sorry, but the only understanding those in the old testament system would have would be concerning the Levitical practices.The old covenant foreshadowed the new. Which Christ came to fulfill not do away with.
You have no idea what you are talking about.
Reformedguy
Well-known member
So what. They knew of Christ's coming. They knew the gospel. Keep trying.Sorry, but the only understanding those in the old testament system would have would be concerning the Levitical practices.
You provide no evidence that they understood sacrifice and offering would be abolished by the sacrifice of Christ.So what. They knew of Christ's coming. They knew the gospel. Keep trying.
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