Mother Mary

Bonnie said:
Then, if Mary knows the Father like ALL believers, then that means we are equal to Mary, and there is no reason to pray to her for intercession--Jesus tore down the barrier between Him and us, and we can now go directly to our dear Heavenly Father in prayer, as Jesus taught us, in His own prayer: "Our Father, Who art in heaven..."
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But Bonnie she is more equal because she according to the RCC is sinless born without original sin.
 
balshan said:
But Bonnie she is more equal because she according to the RCC is sinless born without original sin.
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How does the IC make Mary equal to Jesus--when the only reason Mary is IC is because of Jesus?

If Jesus is the reason Mary is what she is, how does that make Mary equal with Jesus? If all Mary is depends on Christ, how does this make Mary equal to Christ?
 
dingoling. said:
And the nCCs want us to stop listening to the Pope and Magisterium and listen to what scripture alone says. Put scripture alone doesn't tell us to what scripture alone says. It is a man made doctrine.

Don't you realize how truly silly, and gullible the nCCs sound?
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No it is RCs who are gullible, they think that men who do not expose sin, who hide crimes, who teach false doctrines are successors to the apostles.
 
romishpopishorganist said:
I didn't mean, sir, that Luther threw God out.

I meant--the baby is the Church. The bathwater the moral corruption he rightly went after. Luther threw the baby (the Church) out with the bathwater (moral corruption.)
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No the church could never be described as a baby. More like a dirty old man who needs cleaning. Luther tried to clean it up and he was thrown out. The RCC is still morally corrupt. It has not used the bath water to clean itself up at all. Shame.
 
romishpopishorganist said:
How does the IC make Mary equal to Jesus--when the only reason Mary is IC is because of Jesus?

If Jesus is the reason Mary is what she is, how does that make Mary equal with Jesus? If all Mary is depends on Christ, how does this make Mary equal to Christ?
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No really what I said was it. I said she was more equal than us because she according to RCs was born without original sin and never sinned. Talk about things going over people's heads, it seems you had to twist my post to say something it didn't. But it is the RC way.

I have never said Mary is equal to Jesus. Please show in my post 1362 where I ever even hinted at that. You are reading what you want to read, not what I wrote.
 
romishpopishorganist said:
How does the IC make Mary equal to Jesus--when the only reason Mary is IC is because of Jesus?

If Jesus is the reason Mary is what she is, how does that make Mary equal with Jesus? If all Mary is depends on Christ, how does this make Mary equal to Christ?
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If the Catholic "Mary" was "immaculately conceived" and was "completely SINLESS" human, then SHE could have been crucified for our sin as the perfect SIN OFFERING instead of Jesus.

OF course since the "Catholic Mary" is all a Catholic Fantasy, and the REAL Mary was really a Normal human and obedient Jewish Gal, called for a special, but difficult ministry, and needed a SAVIOR to cleanse her SIN just like the rest of us, that wouldn't have worked.
 
dingoling. said:
And the nCCs want us to stop listening to the Pope and Magisterium and listen to what scripture alone says. Put scripture alone doesn't tell us to what scripture alone says. It is a man made doctrine.
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Oh, you finally got it! Listen and believe the Scriptures alone and what THEY say! Bingo!

And yes, the Bible does indirectly teach Scripture alone for doctrine. Paul never said man-made teachings make the man of God complete, did he? And what did Jesus say about teaching for doctrine the precepts of men? And what about all the warnings in the Bible against adding or subtracting from His word?
dingoling. said:
Don't you realize how truly silly, and gullible the nCCs sound?
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How foolish of us! Relying on God's holy word, the Bible, instead of man-made doctrines added centuries later...what WERE we THINKING of...horrors! ???
 
romishpopishorganist said:
In essence, Luther rejected the authority of the pope and bishops and instead declared himself the pope and bishops all rolled in to one. So Luther in effect, expected people to listen to HIM, not the real pope and bishops.
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In essence, Luther obeyed God instead of mere corrupt men, who "taught for doctrine the precepts of men." Where does the Bible tell us to follow blindly corrupt leaders who teach false doctrines? And never expose error? WHERE?

So, Luther, in essence, wanted people to read the Bible and believe it--which, thanks to the printing press and Luther's German translation--became far more accessible to the common folk.
 
dingoling. said:
So all these other churches that came out of the Reformation who didn't agree with Luther are wrong too?
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No what it shows is that the RCC who as one RC said in a post was morally corrupt at the time, did not learn anything at all. It stayed and continues to stay morally corrupt. Just look at its fruit over the centuries. Stop looking to blame others for the reformation, the cause of the reformation was and still is your leaders.
 
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