"Where was your Church before Luther?"

Stella1000 said:
Unity in Christ doesn't absolve a Christian from evangelising. The Pharisees picked that bone with Jesus who was communing with 'undesirables'...

Mark 2 13-17 13 Once again Jesus went out beside the lake. A large crowd came to him, and he began to teach them. 14 As he walked along, he saw Levi son of Alphaeus sitting at the tax collector’s booth. “Follow me,” Jesus told him, and Levi got up and followed him.

15 While Jesus was having dinner at Levi’s house, many tax collectors and sinners were eating with him and his disciples, for there were many who followed him. 16 When the teachers of the law who were Pharisees saw him eating with the sinners and tax collectors, they asked his disciples: “Why does he eat with tax collectors and sinners?”

17 On hearing this, Jesus said to them, “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.”
Click to expand...
But those people weren't masquerading as THE church with ALL the fullness of truth. Nor were they telling anyone that anyone out of their circle were accursed. Huge Difference!
 
dingoling. said:
Scripture alone has never worked.
Click to expand...


In other words, your saying following Christ never worked. Can't get anymore anti-Christ than the above statement. Because Scripture is God speaking to us. Did the rcc create the heavens and the earth and all that they contained? Did your institution die for you? You keep pointing people away from Christ. NOT to Him.

Not only is God all knowing, all seeing, but He is also everywhere. So a person does not need to be in a rcc to hear the gospel. God is fully capable of reaching us, right where we are at. Whether that be in a store, walking down the street, in a park.... etc....
 
A new day said:
In other words, your saying following Christ never worked. Can't get anymore anti-Christ than the above statement. Because Scripture is God speaking to us. Did the rcc create the heavens and the earth and all that they contained? Did your institution die for you? You keep pointing people away from Christ. NOT to Him.

Not only is God all knowing, all seeing, but He is also everywhere. So a person does not need to be in a rcc to hear the gospel. God is fully capable of reaching us, right where we are at. Whether that be in a store, walking down the street, in a park.... etc....
Click to expand...
Following Christ and scripture alone are not the same.
 
Waldensian Knight said:
What alternative to Scripture alone is correct then?

-The Eastern Patriarchs?
-The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society?
-The Roman Magisterium?
-Rabbinical traditions?
-The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints?
-Most Holy Family Monastery?

All of these contradict Scripture and are also internally contradictory.
Click to expand...
The one Jesus gave authority to - the Pope/Magisterium.
 
Nondenom40 said:
I don't know you or where you are at spiritually i just know that from myself and all the testimonies i've heard over the years not one single person who is born again sat around trying to figure out which church was correct before making a decision about Jesus. We are broken, sinful people who want salvation, know its in Jesus and want one thing, Jesus. Not a church to belong to. The last thing anyone is thinking about when they are giving their lives to Him is what church can i join. If you are about to get into a car accident, you see it coming and can't do a thing about it, you aren't thinking what autobody shop should i go to. You are thinking about your life. Same with those who are born again. There is one thing on their mind and its not where am i gonna go to church. I don't want to take you out of context but we get this very thing from catholics too. I'll comment on some other things later. I don't mean to question your salvation. Just seeing something there that i would clarify.
Click to expand...
So it seems you are saying that you don't need the Church if it doesn't matter where you go. It could be church of 1 or 2 at the kitchen table.
Where you go to Church matters considerably. 2ßZ
Waldensian Knight said:
What alternative to Scripture alone is correct then?

-The Eastern Patriarchs?
-The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society?
-The Roman Magisterium?
-Rabbinical traditions?
-The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints?
-Most Holy Family Monastery?

All of these contradict Scripture and are also internally contradictory.
Click to expand...
Which one is the pillar and foundation of the truth?
 
A new day said:
In other words, your saying following Christ never worked. Can't get anymore anti-Christ than the above statement. Because Scripture is God speaking to us. Did the rcc create the heavens and the earth and all that they contained? Did your institution die for you? You keep pointing people away from Christ. NOT to Him.

Not only is God all knowing, all seeing, but He is also everywhere. So a person does not need to be in a rcc to hear the gospel. God is fully capable of reaching us, right where we are at. Whether that be in a store, walking down the street, in a park.... etc....
Click to expand...
dingoling. said:
Following Christ and scripture alone are not the same.
Click to expand...
why not?
 
pilgrim said:
So it seems you are saying that you don't need the Church if it doesn't matter where you go. It could be church of 1 or 2 at the kitchen table.
Where you go to Church matters considerably. 2ßZ

Which one is the pillar and foundation of the truth?
Click to expand...

We do NOT need the rcc, to believe in and trust Jesus Christ alone to save us. There is NO mediator between Jesus and man.
 
pilgrim said:
Scripture says the Church is the pillar and foundation of the truth. But now you're saying that isn't true.
Click to expand...
It obviously means something different than what you say it means. Three men Catholicism considers popes (though one of these men lived before the papacy was established) had radically different views on salvation.

-"Pope" Clement said that we are saved by faith alone.
-Pope Boniface VIII said that you must submit to the pope to be saved.
-Pope Francis says that you can die an atheist and go to heaven.

On the other hand, Scripture clearly says that the view held by Clement is the correct one.
 
pilgrim said:
Could you provide the quote? I would really like to see if he used the words "faith" and "alone".
Click to expand...
Similarly we also, who by His will have been called in Christ Jesus, are not justified by ourselves, or our own wisdom or understanding or godliness, nor by such deeds as we have done in holiness of heart, but by that faith through which Almighty God has justified all men since the beginning of time. Glory be to Him, forever and ever, Amen.
Click to expand...
Not the exact words, but the idea is there.
 
pilgrim said:
Could you provide the quote? I would really like to see if he used the words "faith" and "alone".
Click to expand...
Similarly we also, who by His will have been called in Christ Jesus, are not justified by ourselves, or our own wisdom or understanding or godliness, nor by such deeds as we have done in holiness of heart, but by that faith through which Almighty God has justified all men since the beginning of time. Glory be to Him, forever and ever, Amen.
Click to expand...
Waldensian Knight said:
Not the exact words, but the idea is there.
Click to expand...
What I suspected from the beginning was that you had sourced a cherry picked sentence (from Chapter 32) taken out of the context of the whole letter. If you access the whole letter you'll find it goes on to behoove us to (Chapter 33) Let Us Not Give Up the Practice of Good Works and Love and (Chapter 34) Great is the Reward of Good Works with God. Joined Together in Harmony, Let Us Implore that Reward from Him.

Those verses of the letter you cite, explain perfectly Catholic teaching on faith and works.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top