The Immaculate Conception

[Nondenom40]

The pillar and foundation of the truth cannot lie.

Thankfully the rcc isn't the pillar and foundation of God's word. In fact it claims not to even need it. Why claim to be something you have no love for?

 

[balshan]

"Purified through her intercession"? What blasphemy is this? Only one thing purifies us--grace through faith in Christ Jesus our Lord.

They just keep coming up with this rubbish and is totally anti scriptural.

 

[balshan]

No one says we are saved by works alone. Why do Protestants keep saying this?

Why cannot one RC tells us faith and what saves. Because RCs do not clearly explain their false beliefs.

 

[balshan]

The pillar and foundation of the truth cannot lie.

Yet it does over and over again, throughout the centuries. It lies to the laity, it lies about its leaders and what they have done, it teaches false doctrines (another form of lying), it lies to authority and worse of all it lies when it falsely claims to be the pillar and foundation of truth, it is the one true church.

The one true church does not have leaders who lie, who commit sexually immoral sins, who hide sin and do not expose it, or leaders who fail the spiritual requirements for leaders. Your leaders show/prove the claims made by your institution are false.

 

[balshan]

What does 1 Timothy 3:15 mean when it says that the church is the pillar and foundation of the truth? | GotQuestions.org

What does 1 Timothy 3:15 mean when it says that the church is the pillar and foundation of the truth? Is the Bible the authority, or is the church the authority?

www.gotquestions.org

“The church,” that is, the entire population of Christian believers, bears the earthly responsibility of holding up the truth of the gospel. The ultimate basis of that truth is Christ, not the proclamations or infallibility of members of that body. Paul is calling on believers to care for the structure that “supports” or “props up” our message to the world. First Timothy 3:15 cannot be taken to mean that the church itself is the source or standard for truth.

Spot on.

 

[balshan]

Yes, the Catechism does teach the Marian dogmas--but God's holy word, the Bible, does NOT.


Catholics practice mariolatry all the time without realizing it, since they have been indoctrinated to pray to saints dead in the Lord.


Certainly bearing Jesus was highly important, though I can think of a task even more important than that--Jesus' dying on the cross to pay for all of our sins. But bearing Jesus in His humanity doesn't mean it is hunky-dory to pray to Mary as one does to God, pleading for help, salvation, succor, etc.


And it is just as much a fallacy to claim that Jesus might have wanted them, because He was not recorded as speaking against the 4 Marian dogmas. But then, we have Jesus recorded as saying the greatest among those born of woman was John the Baptist, yet the least in the Kingdom of Heaven is greater than he. Not one word about Mary being the greatest mortal who ever lived.


Well, this kinda gives us the impression that Catholics worship Mary, since there are Catholic prayers to her that, if the pronouns were changed, would make jim-dandy prayers to God. Like this one:

  - Another Marian prayer that shows too much veneration

...to Mary. This is the prayer to Our Lady of Perpetual Help: Behold, O Mother of Perpetual Help, at thy feet a wretched sinner, who has recourse to thee and trusts in thee. O Mother of mercy, have pity on me; I hear all men call thee the refuge and hope of sinners: be therefore my refuge and...

forums.carm.org

How is this not worship?

here is another prayer to her:



How is this not worship?

I thought it is the HS who keeps us safe from deception.....? But if it is Mary, she is doing a lousy job, since so many Rccers have been deceived by their popes, spiritual leaders, and their entire church to believe false doctrines--like the 4 Marian dogmas.


And this of course, that I have put on here before:

How is this not worship?





Ex-Catholics have seen the situation from both sides. Their eyes have been opened by the HS and they can see that many of the Catholic practices and beliefs are unbiblical and heretical--like the 4 Marian Dogmas and praying to saints dead in the Lord as one would pray to God.

I suggest you look in the mirror, LifeIn.

Once again you hit the nail on the head.

 

[romishpopishorganist]

Explain "how" it is "true."

The Scriptures, Tradition, and Church all in distinct ways testify to its truth.

 

[Nondenom40]

The Scriptures, Tradition, and Church all in distinct ways testify to its truth.

Scriptures? Youre the guy that says very often and very loudly that youre NOT a sola scriptura person and you have zero need or desire to prove a scintilla of your doctrines and dogmas from scripture. Now youre here saying your marian dogmas are proven from the scripture? I'd ask where but you'll just go into some diatribe about not being a sola scriptura person. The scriptures say precisely nothing about your marian dogmas.

 

[Bonnie]

No one says we are saved by works alone. Why do Protestants keep saying this?

I don't say it.

 

[Bonnie]

The Scriptures, Tradition, and Church all in distinct ways testify to its truth.

Catholic tradition and your church do not testify to the truth, but testify to many doctrinal errors and practices.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Mary was not a disciple BEFORE the crucifixion?

Show me the record of it. Her other kids didn't believe that Jesus was anything special (Mary, and the kids thought He was nuts). I see no evidence that the REAL Mary tagged along with Jesus and the 12. And, of course NOBODY was "Born again" until after Calvary (John 20:22).

 

[balshan]

The Scriptures, Tradition, and Church all in distinct ways testify to its truth.

The Scriptures do, the real church does and God's tradition are the truth. But your institutions false RCC interpretation of scripture, its false traditions and teachings reveal you institution is not the Church and do not testify to the truth. It is the TRUTH when we are discussing scripture not its truth, that word diminishes the fact that scripture is the word of God.

 

[Bonnie]

The pillar and foundation of the truth cannot lie.

Your church has been teaching errors in doctrine and practice for centuries, and hasn't upheld the truth of God's holy word for those centuries--it is more interested in upholding itself and its power, in its arrogance and pride.

 

[balshan]

Scriptures? Youre the guy that says very often and very loudly that youre NOT a sola scriptura person and you have zero need or desire to prove a scintilla of your doctrines and dogmas from scripture. Now youre here saying your marian dogmas are proven from the scripture? I'd ask where but you'll just go into some diatribe about not being a sola scriptura person. The scriptures say precisely nothing about your marian dogmas.

That is just diverting from the fact that the Marian doctrines are not found in scripture.

 

[pilgrim]

“The church,” that is, the entire population of Christian believers, bears the earthly responsibility of holding up the truth of the gospel. The ultimate basis of that truth is Christ, not the proclamations or infallibility of members of that body. Paul is calling on believers to care for the structure that “supports” or “props up” our message to the world. First Timothy 3:15 cannot be taken to mean that the church itself is the source or standard for truth.

"The Church" in Scripture was of one mind, one accord.
Can the same be said of "the entire population of Christian believers"? No, it cannot.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Yes.

But I do not believe it becasue the pope orders me to believe it, I believe it becasue it is true.

The pope does not making doctrines true becasue he defines them, the pope defines doctrines becasue they are true.

CHuckle!!! Unless they're not true at all, and never have been true.

 

[4Him]

"The Church" in Scripture was of one mind, one accord.

Was it? There's a reason the Scriptures teach about false teachers and prophets.

Can the same be said of "the entire population of Christian believers"? No, it cannot.

For those that believe the Scriptures yes....unlike churches like yours that teach doctrines nowhere found or supported by the actual word of God.

Would you care to actually address what I posted?

 

[balshan]

"The Church" in Scripture was of one mind, one accord.
Can the same be said of "the entire population of Christian believers"? No, it cannot.

I am laughing at the concept of their institution being of one mind, one accord We have seen the way they post to one another. We have witnessed over the decades the changes in teaching. We can see the many minds over things like gay RCs which reveal they are not of one mind, one accord. This is just a tip of the examples of that false concept of the RCC.

 

[pilgrim]

Was it? There's a reason the Scriptures teach about false teachers and prophets.

For those that believe the Scriptures yes....unlike churches like yours that teach doctrines nowhere found or supported by the actual word of God.

Would you care to actually address what I posted?

Scripture said so. False teachers and prophets put themselves outside the Church with their false beliefs.

 

[pilgrim]

What does 1 Timothy 3:15 mean when it says that the church is the pillar and foundation of the truth? | GotQuestions.org

What does 1 Timothy 3:15 mean when it says that the church is the pillar and foundation of the truth? Is the Bible the authority, or is the church the authority?

www.gotquestions.org

“The church,” that is, the entire population of Christian believers, bears the earthly responsibility of holding up the truth of the gospel. The ultimate basis of that truth is Christ, not the proclamations or infallibility of members of that body. Paul is calling on believers to care for the structure that “supports” or “props up” our message to the world. First Timothy 3:15 cannot be taken to mean that the church itself is the source or standard for truth.

That doesn't exactly sound like an invisible church.