Over several years it was proven to me the truth of 1Cor 2:13-15. It is counterproductive to argue, everyone has own path.Perhaps. I hope that is true but it is not evidenced in these posts, and that begs the question, "what good is a gift that is not evidenced?"
Matthew 5:14-16
"You are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden; nor does anyone light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on the lampstand, and it gives light to all who are in the house. "Let your light shine before men in such a way that they may see your good works and glorify your Father who is in heaven."
Do you think your posts correctly evidence obedience to that standard and the claim of higher gifts? Red herrings are not something the Holy Spirit inspires or empowers. The Spirit may be extra-rational but it is never irrational. That comment about concrete blocks undermined any claim you might ever have of higher gifts here in this thread.
The matter in question has to do with the statements found in post 7, which states,
....and then in the subsequent posts I read,
Do you know and understand the language of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is uniquely New Testament and inherently limited to the matters of soteriology, ecclesiology, and eschatology? Outside of those domains we do not find the language used in scripture. If you're using the concepts of Valentinius (one of the Gnostics who leveraged the concept of kenoma) then his hermeneutic is deeply flawed, and as I have stated previously deemed heretical. Give Martyr and Irenaeus a read because they addressed the Valentinian iteration of Gnosticism and his views of kenoma.
You've gone on record stating "your book" says post 7 is not heresy but you've failed to answer which book is your book. The actual text of Hebrews 11:3 can be objectively shown NOT to say what you claimed it said. The concrete block comment is not only a red herring, it's non sequitur and as I just said the Holy Spirit NEVER speaks fallaciously. The comment about higher gifts (another red herring non sequitur) is implicitly self-aggrandizing at the expense of another and without elevating Christ. The Psalm 40/Hebrews 10 quote is completely misrepresented.
Not only does it not prove post 7 orthodox, it does not evidence higher gifts. It does avoid the replies brought to bear upon it and completely ignores the op.
I'll be moving on now.
An Apologetic Paradox
- Thread starter shnarkle
- Start date
Over several years it was proven to me the truth of 1Cor 2:13-15. It is counterproductive to argue, everyone has own path.
HealTheLand
Active member
by what standard we judge others we ourselves will be judged. we can have ideas about how people should be -- that come from our self (own standards and unique dna and background and spiritual walk and beliefs, character traits, ect.), but someone else can be quite different than us and appearing not to live up to our own standards -- we have set up (not God has set) and yet just be different than us and imperfect -- but in their own unique imperfections and walk with Christ... new or old to the walking / learning. so we can greatly misjudge someone in that way -- by imposing our own standards upon another (too / overly much)... not showing grace -- even though we are not perfect yet ourselves, and might bother others also -- just by being are ourselves ( intending no harm)... and would hope / like to think others will try to give is the benefit of the doubt when we speak... and not judge by the outward -- seeming -- some of which, and often maybe can be -- projections, and not how we perceive at all...
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It is for those who has another agendas for your gods and not have in yourself the One Jesus had in himself as you are su[pp[osed to have in yourself.
He merely was a mortal man made of a woman born under the law no different from you or I.
And you falsely accuse him of being God just as those of his day falsely accused him of being God, he was innocent of charge for sure. You are only convicting him to a position no man can be in least you have denied the God of Spirit that came to Jesus and spend up in Him who He is in Matt 3:16, which to you is veridical just as you say His way is.,m
SO are we all who has from God that what Jesus had from Him as you are su[pposed to have in you as well to be perfect as your Father in heaven and walk as He walks in His same light with the sam signs following. All of that means noting for you does it?
So are all who is born of God. You are supposed to be born of Him as well, born again to be like him instead of yourself in your man made beliefs for a god, probable gods for I figure you worship three of them which is common among those who never has met Him as Jesus did in Matt 3:16.
Amen and the word became flesh and dwells among us all who has receieved God in us that we may know His word from God Himself and not from a book with second hand information, for we all who has receieved from God has a hot line to Him.
Gods word is not written on stone of a page of paper, Jesus said that in that day ye shall ask me noting but go to the Father for yourself and He will give it you. God does not hand someones a book and say here read it, He hands someone His own mind to walks He walks in it.
That is because you never have met the Spirit of Christ, which is Gods anointing in you, or is supposed to be. You cant see the Spirit of Christ at all just as you said.
That is what I said, Christ is Gods Spirit in man, man anointed of God. You dont even know the definition of the Christ. It is Gods anointing in man. it would do you well to receive His anointing, Christ in you. Cant know God without it.
Your god is a man, my God is the same One Jesus obeyed and prayed to and said sent him and said he could do noting at all without Him. But you seem to be able to do everything without Him, but Jesus couldn't.
There is no mistake all, you just dont believe thatGod came to Jesus as it says and opens up who He is and all of His heaven in that man. he is supposed to do the same in you. Jesus referred too this process of sanctification as born again to be like the Father of it instead of all this hocus focus, soothsaying that you are presenting from religious mind.
SO are we all who is born of God as Jesus to be His child as Jesus was. you act as if Jesus wasn't born of God to be His child, son, you have Meade him a god in the pace of the One Jesus obeyed.
Everyone does the same who has received form God that what Jesus did as you are supposed to yourself. It isn't something to be grasped, it is something we become no different from Jesus at all least you are not born of God and not His child as Jesus was.
Yes but not the way you perceive it through that religious mentality aside from Gods anointing Who will come to you and sup with you and be in you just as He did in Jesus. You just do not follow the ways of Jesus to be is all.
I truly do understand your position, been there done that myself, so did Jesus until Matt 3:16.
The invisible becomes visible when one can see Him as He really is and when one does see Him as He is, ye shall be like Him. 1 John 3.
Jesus was very clear, Spirit doesnt have flesh and bone as you see me.
I see the biggest problem in Christendom is, they dont receive Gods Spirit to even know Him, let alone be like Him as it says when one actually does see what Spirit is all about. Spirit= mind, and not everyone has that same Spirit, mind, of Christ as Jesus had from God.
The revelation of the Christ is Christ revealed, nearly all are still waiting for a man to come as a God that they can see flesh and bone but cant comprehend the Spirit of God that will come to them this day, for He is at the door knocking and anyone who will open it He will come to you and sup with you and be in you no different at all from him coming into Jesus in Matt 3:16. In which most here dont believe that He did, that is very obvious in their comments that the Bible is wrong and Jesus didnt need God to reveal Himself to Jesus.
Everyone is judged by the same judgment they judge with. it always comes to surface what is in a man. It isn't hard to judges who is and who isn't as Jesus was as we are supposed to be according to God and the one He sent tho show us what that is to be like Him.
Everyone knows very well if they are like Him or not as God demands of us if we are to be of Him and making themselves judge of self.
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invisible is non physical, not detectable by regular senses , only by "clear eye".
Yes, spiritual eyes. Matt 3:16 is very clear in this, God came to Jesus by that invisible entity and what happened, He opens Jesus spiritual eyes where Jesus saw Him as He is where God opsenf who he isn all of His heaven in Jesus.
Most dont believe Matt 3:16 that God did that in Jesus only because they haven't had their eyes opened by God Himself the very same way.
I understand John's baptism. 99% of Christians do not.
Matt 3;16 is what happens in us all who becomes born of God as Jesus did in Matt 3:16, he didnt know God nor His heaven either until God opened it all to him -- we all can read it.
Josheb
Well-known member
What, specifically, is it that leads you to conclude 99% of Christians do not understand John's baptism but you do and you're in the 1% of all Christendom that correctly understands?
Because most only know water baptism but never has met God to be baptized by Him. They stop at the water troff and go no further spiritually to have from God to be like Him.
It was a NDE type with straight vision of spiritual world. Only those spiritually ready (like Jesus) could see "water and spirit") connection. Acts 19.
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JonHawk
Well-known member
If they knew the water, the rest [in Christ] is elementary my dear gnostic.
For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit. Acts 1
Water is not going to reveal God LOL. Jesus went into the water a son of God and came out of the water a wet son of God. Aww but another took place who opens up to Jesus who He is and all of His heaven in that man, aside from water.
You know water and the elementary laws for that man made ritual, but the One obviously you do not know what that second one who came to Jesus. You only stopped at the water troff is all.
And God baptizes by His Spirit. Adam was baptized with it and became like Him, so did Abraham baptized by His Spirit, so did Moses get baptized by His Spirit, Jesus got baptized by His Spirit in Matt 3;16, 120 got baptized with His Spirit, and do did I the very same.
You cant know God at all least you receieve the same, not even Jesus could know Him without Him coming to him for it plainly is written that God really did come and open who He is and all of His heaven in Jesus. He hasn't done the same in you has He? DFo had He you wouldn't mock Him with those cheep gnosticism accusation that you accuse Him of.
JonHawk
Well-known member
“I baptize you with water for repentance. But after me comes one who is more powerful than I,...He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit...Matt 3
“Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” So they said to him, “We have not so much as heard whether there is a Holy Spirit.”
Paul said, “John indeed baptized with a baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.”
5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
Yes, John warned Jesus there was One coming after him who John couldn't give Jesus, that One came to Jesus and opend up who He is and His heaven. That is the One you are missing.
No' when I obeyed and receieved as Jesus obeyed and received in Matt 3:16 the same.
Seems you haven't either?
By a man in water but not by God by His Spirit as Jesus did in Matt 3:16 where God Himself opens to you all of who He is and all of His heaven to you.
Hhe hasn't done that in you has He?
JonHawk
Well-known member
What you seem to know is irrelevant.
For nothing is secret that will not be revealed, nor anything hidden that will not be known and come to light. 18 Therefore take heed how you hear. For whoever has, to him more will be given; and whoever does not have, even what he [a]seems to have will be taken from him. Luke 8
Actually what I do know from God Himself as Jesus knew from God Himself, is irrelevant for you.
Just as it was revealed in Jesus and us all who has received the same from God.
And He has taken away from you and given to us all who will receive Him as Jesus did.
As far a hearing, not even Jesus could hear God until he obeyed and God came to him and opened up his hearing in Matt 3:16. he does the same in us all who will obey and receive.
JonHawk
Well-known member
But I know you, that you do not have the love of God in you. 43 I have come in My Father’s name, and you do not receive Me; John 5
But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: