Measles a new..old... fear

[Harry Leggs]

I don't listen because the entire scientific community has discovered his fraud.

You do not know that. I do not listen for other reasons having to do with bias as opposed to a search for truth. Combined with ignorance. You do not know what you are doing.

Why would I listen to someone like that?

It is not the entire and the situation will only get worse as the austism rates rise assuming they still administer the shots too early. Autism is not inherited autism is environmental which means the shots are in as causal.

 

[CrowCross]

You do not know that. I do not listen for other reasons having to do with bias as opposed to a search for truth. Combined with ignorance. You do not know what you are doing.

It is not the entire and the situation will only get worse as the austism rates rise assuming they still administer the shots too early. Autism is not inherited autism is environmental which means the shots are in as causal.

I don't think they quite understand....for the "common" person to recognize and connect the dots....as well as doctors and others that have done studies....big pharma for the sake of the $ will ensure it remains on the schedule.
People seem to go along with the "fact checks".....as they don't want to appear as ignorant due to the fact they have had their children or grand children take the MMR jab.

 

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

People seem to go along with the "fact checks".....as they don't want to appear as ignorant due to the fact they have had their children or grand children take the MMR jab.

And their children and grandchildren are perfectly healthy.

The only ones who are ignorant, and gullible, are those who place blind trust in what they are told by a discredited doctor without having a shred of evidence to indicate that what he is telling them is medically accurate.

 

[Algor]

I don't think they quite understand....for the "common" person to recognize and connect the dots....as well as doctors and others that have done studies....big pharma for the sake of the $ will ensure it remains on the schedule.
People seem to go along with the "fact checks".....as they don't want to appear as ignorant due to the fact they have had their children or grand children take the MMR jab.

Hi CrowCross. Drooped in and saw this. You might be interested in reading this (if you have not already)

The MMR vaccine and autism: Sensation, refutation, retraction, and fraud

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

If you follow citations 10-13 they are to articles by a Journalist, Brian Deer, who details especially in citation 12 how the autism related enterocolitis was put together as part of a business plan for selling a molecular diagnostic test and an altered vaccination.

Given the previous week’s publicity drive, the vaccine plans were sensitive. But the school had long known of this ambition. First surfacing in Wakefield’s 1995 patent for a diagnostic test for Crohn’s disease, it had been fleshed out in 1997, eight months before the press conference, in a patent for a “safer” single measles shot.30

"The revised business plan was ambitious and detailed, aiming to raise £2.1m from investors. It spanned the detection of Crohn’s disease, the treatment of autism, and “a replacement for attenuated viral vaccines.”

It is a bit of a sad and greasy tale, involving money, institutional carelessness and self interest, coverups, and old fashioned grifting. It does not redound with glory on either the established experts OR those arguing with them to be sure, and it is reasonable to ask that if the guys who everybody now says were right behaved only slightly less badly than the people who are named fraudulent, why should anyone believe any of it?

My answer to that lies in ideas of consilience, parsimony and conflicting self interest: any number of different organizations and people have looked at the vaccine MMR link, many with differing agendas, and the best published data agrees with both the simplest explanations, and the explanations that make the most sense given what we know of brain, gut and immune physiology. But that's me. I do think I know what I am talking about as I have been professionally fooling around in this area for a few decades now and I think I know the basics reasonably well, but I must say that I have some sympathy with anyone who declares a pox on all the houses involved.

Anyhow, see you around. Take care.

 

[Algor]

I hired the Senior epidemiologist from a large local teaching and research hospital.

Nobody believes this.

 

[Algor]

Hmm!! Measels, Mumps, Chicken Pox, and Rubella (German Measles) were all just "rites of passage" in the '40s when I was growing up. and for some Tuberculosis was a scourge, and towns had large TB Hospitals and hundreds of iron lungs. that kids lived in for YEARS. I had 'em all (Rubella a couple of times).

BUT HEY!!! THE SKY IS FALLING!!! THE SKY IS FALLING!!!! WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE - HORRIBLY!!! But - let's have lunch first.

Bob.......Measels is usually benign, it is true. But there is a fairly constant small proportion of families for whom it turns into a tragedy.

This disease:

Subacute sclerosing panencephalitis - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

is thankfully (nearly) extinct in the developed world because of vaccination. It is a crawling horror of pediatric disease. But whatever.

 

[LifeIn]

It is not the entire and the situation will only get worse as the austism rates rise...

Two points (which have been mentioned before, but perhaps you forgot):

1. Rates of reported autism have risen partly (and perhaps wholly) due to increased awareness of the condition that previously went undiagnosed or misdiagnosed.

2. Many changes in societal behavior and environmental exposure occurred concurrent with this reported rise. The increased use of vaccinations is just one of many such changes. There is no reason to single out vaccinations, especially since they have been extensively studied by medical researchers who have concluded there is no significant statistical connection between autism and vaccination, let alone a causal mechanism.

 

[CrowCross]

And their children and grandchildren are perfectly healthy.

The only ones who are ignorant, and gullible, are those who place blind trust in what they are told by a discredited doctor without having a shred of evidence to indicate that what he is telling them is medically accurate.

If that's what you need to believe to not feel guilty or whatever....have at it.

 

[CrowCross]

Nobody believes this.

Why would I not believe Authentic Nouveau?

 

[Algor]

Why would I not believe Authentic Nouveau?

Because his posts about medicine and science are semi-literate garbled nonsense that anyone who has attended the university of Google but had no actual training could come up with, despite the fact that he claims to be (in a carefully vague manner) a medical "insider" who has spent thousands of hours in the operating room.

 

[Temujin]

Why would I not believe Authentic Nouveau?

Because nothing he says is remotely believable. His posts are performance art not a description of reality.

 

[CrowCross]

Because his posts about medicine and science are semi-literate garbled nonsense that anyone who has attended the university of Google but had no actual training could come up with, despite the fact that he claims to be (in a carefully vague manner) a medical "insider" who has spent thousands of hours in the operating room.

Are you claiming Authentic Nouveau is lying? Are you saying he has not spent thousands of hours in an operating room?

 

[CrowCross]

Because nothing he says is remotely believable. His posts are performance art not a description of reality.

Yet another one speaks with no proof.

From what I understand you openly worship Satan.

 

[Algor]

Are you claiming Authentic Nouveau is lying? Are you saying he has not spent thousands of hours in an operating room?

I'm saying that I do not believe him. Draw whatever conclusions you want from that, but what he says about himself wrt medicine is not plausible.

 

[LifeIn]

Are you claiming Authentic Nouveau is lying? Are you saying he has not spent thousands of hours in an operating room?

Actually, it does not matter what someone says about their credentials. Everyone here is anonymous, and has zero credentials that can be established in a debate. The problem is that when a poster uses his claimed credentials as the reason for why what he says should be trusted. No one should do that in a debate forum.

 

[Temujin]

Yet another one speaks with no proof.

From what I understand you openly worship Satan.

Which confirms your lack of understanding on any subject.

 

[Harry Leggs]

Two points (which have been mentioned before, but perhaps you forgot):

1. Rates of reported autism have risen partly (and perhaps wholly) due to increased awareness of the condition that previously went undiagnosed or misdiagnosed.

That means the problem is heredity and not the environment. They ought to be able to track down the inherited cause if that is the case. They have not and there are plenty of siblings in families who have not got Autism where one has. It is straight-up BS to presuppose the skyrocketing cases of autism in toddlers is inherited and people back in the 70s were ignorant. You have normal development then the shots and then regression. Loss of ability to walk and failure to recognize parent and on it goes. I have repeatedly posted these facts and they all go ignored in favor of the boilerplate lies.

2. Many changes in societal behavior and environmental exposure occurred concurrent with this reported rise. The increased use of vaccinations is just one of many such changes.

Unavoidably unsafe shots after the vaccine act of 1986. PREP Act provides corporate welfare for pharma billionaires and shot apologists are all for it. Less stringent safety testing and money makers for zero liability pharma billionaires who do not even have to hire lawyers. Three-in-one shots where single shots would be safer? Let all this and more bounce off your head.

https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/LSB/LSB10443

There is no reason to single out vaccinations, especially since they have been extensively studied by medical researchers who have concluded there is no significant statistical connection between autism and vaccination, let alone a causal mechanism.

yeah there is and i have no control over shot apologist's willful ignorance

 

[LifeIn]

That means the problem is heredity and not the environment.

That's not true. As I said, the rise could be increased awareness and and not a actual rise at all. Or it could be environment or social practices (life style). There is no reason it has to be heredity. None whatsoever.

It is straight-up BS to presuppose the skyrocketing cases of autism in toddlers...

It is straight-up BS to presuppose that there even is a skyrocketing of real cases. It could be just and increased awareness of a condition that has always been there, but was not diagnosed.

and people back in the 70s were ignorant.

There is no shame in being ignorant of something that was very difficult to diagnose in the first place.

You have normal development then the shots and then regression.

The timing of the shots is at a certain number of years. The timing of the appearance and recognition also happens to be at the same number of years. It is no surprise that they might be observed in close proximity, even if they have no causal relationship at all between then. It is a simple statistical mistake you are making to assume a causal connection whenever there is a correlation.

I have repeatedly posted these facts

I see no reference to those facts here, so I will just have to assume this is bluster.

How do you account for the fact that the occurrence of autism among the unvaccinated is the same as among the vaccinated, as numerous studies have shown?

 

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Because his posts about medicine and science are semi-literate garbled nonsense that anyone who has attended the university of Google but had no actual training could come up with, despite the fact that he claims to be (in a carefully vague manner) a medical "insider" who has spent thousands of hours in the operating room.

Consequently AN's boasts chime perfectly with the views of CrowCross, Harry Leggs et al

 

[Algor]

Consequently AN's boasts chime perfectly with the views of CrowCross, Harry Leggs et al

Hi Hypatia.

I recall you as an evasive, low key abusive poster who has a history of not very well veiled antisemitism. So while I agree with some of your opinions, I confess that I share some of their contempt for your attitude.

Its probably best that you simply avoid me. Thanks.