Parkland school shooting DOJ settlement over 125 million

[LifeIn]

Another of your misquote tricks.
Doesn't prove they could NOT have.

Word games all you have?

You missed the simple obvious point. They didn't bother to investigate.

The fact that the FBI failed to investigate is grounds for winning a lawsuit. I didn't miss that or deny it. It just doesn't change the fact that prior to his shooting rampage, Nickolas Cruz had the right under the 2nd amendment to have a gun. If the FBI or any police agency had acted to take away his guns or confine him, the NRA would have leapt to his defense, and in view of the Heller decision, the NRA would have won and forced the police to give back his guns and apologize to him for infringing on his 2nd amendment rights. That's how crazy gun rights have gotten in this country. However some states and localities have enacted red flag laws that could have been used to take away his guns pending an investigation. The NRA opposes those laws too.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

The fact that the FBI failed to investigate is grounds for winning a lawsuit.

More word games

I didn't miss that or deny it. It just doesn't change the fact that prior to his shooting rampage, Nickolas Cruz had the right under the 2nd amendment to have a gun. If the FBI or any police agency had acted to take away his guns or confine him, the NRA would have leapt to his defense, and in view of the Heller decision, the NRA would have won and forced the police to give back his guns and apologize to him for infringing on his 2nd amendment rights. That's how crazy gun rights have gotten in this country. However some states and localities have enacted red flag laws that could have been used to take away his guns pending an investigation. The NRA opposes those laws too.

No links?

Like you couldn't find any links either when you doubled down and said Mike Mannn was awarded Nobel Prize.

"would have arguments" are inferior speculations.

 

[LifeIn]

No links?

Everybody knows the Heller decision and its impact on gun control. Everyone knows that according to that decision Nicolas Cruz had a right to have a gun. Do you need a link to the text of the 2nd amendment, or to the Heller decision?

 

[Mike McK]

Everybody knows the Heller decision and its impact on gun control. Everyone knows that according to that decision Nicolas Cruz had a right to have a gun. Do you need a link to the text of the 2nd amendment, or to the Heller decision?

Clearly, you do not understand the facts surrounding the Cruz case.

Cruz was not able to purchase the hunting rifle legally because of Heller, but because law enforcement agencies at multiple levels failed to enforce those laws that would have caused him to fail his background check.

 

[LifeIn]

Clearly, you do not understand the facts surrounding the Cruz case.

Cruz was not able to purchase the hunting rifle legally because of Heller, but because law enforcement agencies at multiple levels failed to enforce those laws that would have caused him to fail his background check.

Here is what it takes to fail a background check in Florida:

• Convicted of a felony;

• Convicted of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence that renders them prohibited from purchasing a firearm;
• Had an adjudication of guilt withheld or imposition of sentence suspended on any felony or misdemeanor crime of domestic violence (unless 3 years have elapsed since probation or any other conditions set by the court have been fulfilled or expunction has occurred); or
• Been subject to certain court orders and adjudications related to a serious mental condition.

Two things would have prevented this sale in 2018 when he bought the gun:

• If the age to purchase the gun were 21 instead of 18. Fact: The age WAS raised to 21 following the Parkland shooting. (Too late, legislature).
• If there was some sort of extreme risk protection law that would enable law enforcement to petition the court to prevent a dangerous person from accessing or purchasing a firearm for up to one year. (A so-called "red flag law"). Fact: Such a law was indeed passed in 2018, following the shooting. Again, too late, Florida legislature.

So we see that law enforcement's hands were tied. The Florida legislature admitted as much by passes these two laws too late. Those are the facts of the Cruz case that you might not be aware of.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

Everybody knows the Heller decision and its impact on gun control. Everyone knows that according to that decision Nicolas Cruz had a right to have a gun. Do you need a link to the text of the 2nd amendment, or to the Heller decision?

Everybody knows you don't know what everybody knows.

 

[Mike McK]

Here is what it takes to fail a background check in Florida:

• Convicted of a felony;
• Convicted of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence that renders them prohibited from purchasing a firearm;
• Had an adjudication of guilt withheld or imposition of sentence suspended on any felony or misdemeanor crime of domestic violence (unless 3 years have elapsed since probation or any other conditions set by the court have been fulfilled or expunction has occurred); or
• Been subject to certain court orders and adjudications related to a serious mental condition.

Two things would have prevented this sale in 2018 when he bought the gun:

• If the age to purchase the gun were 21 instead of 18. Fact: The age WAS raised to 21 following the Parkland shooting. (Too late, legislature).
• If there was some sort of extreme risk protection law that would enable law enforcement to petition the court to prevent a dangerous person from accessing or purchasing a firearm for up to one year. (A so-called "red flag law"). Fact: Such a law was indeed passed in 2018, following the shooting. Again, too late, Florida legislature.

So we see that law enforcement's hands were tied. The Florida legislature admitted as much by passes these two laws too late.

Actually, no. Law enforcement's hands were not tied. Law enforcement, at numerous levels, refused to enforce the law. This is why so many people in these different agencies were fired.

Those are the facts of the Cruz case that you might not be aware of.

Here's the funny thing. I'm a teacher in Palm Beach County. I frequently teach in Boca Raton, at two schools that are about five minutes from MSD. This was THE story for months, with every detail dissected 24/7.

Because we were presented with every detail in such depth, and because of the proximity of my schools and MSD, which I frequently have to drive past, by the way, I'm confident that I know the details of this case better than you do.

 

[LifeIn]

Actually, no. Law enforcement's hands were not tied. Law enforcement, at numerous levels, refused to enforce the law.

Please cite the law that Nikolas Cruz broke that would have caused him to fail a background check.

Here's the funny thing. I'm a teacher in Palm Beach County. I frequently teach in Boca Raton, at two schools that are about five minutes from MSD. This was THE story for months, with every detail dissected 24/7.

Because we were presented with every detail in such depth, and because of the proximity of my schools and MSD, which I frequently have to drive past, by the way, I'm confident that I know the details of this case better than you do.

Then please show where I am factually wrong about Cruz qualifying for passing his background check. Appealing to your own personal expertise doesn't work.

 

[Mike McK]

Please cite the law that Nikolas Cruz broke that would have caused him to fail a background check.
Then please show where I am factually wrong about Cruz qualifying for passing his background check.

No thanks. You're the one making the claim. Therefore, it is your responsibility to prove it, not my responsibility to disprove it.

Here's an interesting article. Any one of these would have caused Cruz 4473 to bounce back, had they been reported. Like I said, this is why so many people in the various agencies were fired.

Sheriff says he got 23 calls about shooter's family, but records show more | CNN

Amid criticism for missing warning signs, sheriff Scott Israel insists his office got 23 calls about school shooter Nikolas Cruz or his brother. Records show 45.

www.cnn.com

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

Actually, no. Law enforcement's hands were not tied. Law enforcement, at numerous levels, refused to enforce the law. This is why so many people in these different agencies were fired.



Here's the funny thing. I'm a teacher in Palm Beach County. I frequently teach in Boca Raton, at two schools that are about five minutes from MSD. This was THE story for months, with every detail dissected 24/7.

Because we were presented with every detail in such depth, and because of the proximity of my schools and MSD, which I frequently have to drive past, by the way,

I'm confident that I know the details of this case better than you do.

Not with the internet. Pronoun knows more than you can.
Knows more wazzup in surgery than OR staff.
Pronoun knows more than pathologists. A.S.C.P.

 

[LifeIn]

No thanks. You're the one making the claim.

Nor, your claim is that law enforcement could have stopped Cruz. You need to support that claim.

Here's an interesting article. Any one of these would have caused Cruz 4473 to bounce back, had they been reported. Like I said, this is why so many people in the various agencies were fired.

Sheriff says he got 23 calls about shooter's family, but records show more | CNN

Amid criticism for missing warning signs, sheriff Scott Israel insists his office got 23 calls about school shooter Nikolas Cruz or his brother. Records show 45.

www.cnn.com

This is all about warnings from the public to the Sheriff. I agree. There were plenty of warning signs. However the 2nd amendment prevents law enforcement from taking away someone's guns based only on warnings from the public. After the 2018 red flag law was passed, these warnings could indeed have given law enforcement to take away his guns. Unfortunately that law was passed AFTER the shooting.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

Please cite the law that Nikolas Cruz broke that would have caused him to fail a background check.

Have someone help you with your homework

Then please show where I am factually wrong about Cruz qualifying for passing his background check. Appealing to your own personal expertise doesn't work.

Prove you are correct. All you do is appeal to your opinions as personal expertise.

Just a reminder, I have waited 2 years for you to prove Mike Mannn won Nobel Peace Prize.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

No thanks. You're the one making the claim. Therefore, it is your responsibility to prove it, not my responsibility to disprove it.

Here's an interesting article. Any one of these would have caused Cruz 4473 to bounce back, had they been reported. Like I said, this is why so many people in the various agencies were fired.

Sheriff says he got 23 calls about shooter's family, but records show more | CNN

Amid criticism for missing warning signs, sheriff Scott Israel insists his office got 23 calls about school shooter Nikolas Cruz or his brother. Records show 45.

www.cnn.com

Pronoun has a ODD rash. You have duty to prove and disprove. Oppositional Defiant disorders flare up into full blown bickerfest urges.

 

[Mike McK]

Not with the internet. Pronoun knows more than you can.
Knows more wazzup in surgery than OR staff.
Pronoun knows more than pathologists. A.S.C.P.

One of the schools I teach in is right over the county line from MSD. Literally, about five minutes away. After the shooting, they just went nuts with security, to the point that half of my students' lunch period was wasted just waiting for somebody to let them in the building. Trust me, we're aware of every facet of this case.

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

One of the schools I teach in is right over the county line from MSD. Literally, about five minutes away. After the shooting, they just went nuts with security, to the point that half of my students' lunch period was wasted just waiting for somebody to let them in the building. Trust me, we're aware of every facet of this case.

Yabbut pronoun has CNN

 

[Mike McK]

Nor, your claim is that law enforcement could have stopped Cruz. You need to support that claim.

No, what I said is that law enforcement should have reported their interactions with Cruz. They did not. Now, many of them have been fired.

However the 2nd amendment prevents law enforcement from taking away someone's guns based only on warnings from the public.

I agree. And it should protect us from such things. However, we're not talking about warnings from the public, but interactions with the police, that put the matter into the legal system.

After the 2018 red flag law was passed, these warnings could indeed have given law enforcement to take away his guns. Unfortunately that law was passed AFTER the shooting.

This has nothing to do with red flag laws. This has to do with incidents that cause someone to fail their 4473. No red flag laws necessary.

 

[LifeIn]

No, what I said is that law enforcement should have reported their interactions with Cruz. They did not. Now, many of them have been fired.

I agree with that. It still does not prove Cruz could have legally stopped.

I agree. And it should protect us from such things. However, we're not talking about warnings from the public, but interactions with the police, that put the matter into the legal system.

What level of "interactions" with police qualifies as a reason to take away someone's guns? I posted earlier the only reasons for legally denying someone a gun in Florida in 2018:

• Convicted of a felony;

• Convicted of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence that renders them prohibited from purchasing a firearm;
• Had an adjudication of guilt withheld or imposition of sentence suspended on any felony or misdemeanor crime of domestic violence (unless 3 years have elapsed since probation or any other conditions set by the court have been fulfilled or expunction has occurred); or
• Been subject to certain court orders and adjudications related to a serious mental condition.

Which of these apply to Cruz?

This has nothing to do with red flag laws. This has to do with incidents that cause someone to fail their 4473. No red flag laws necessary.

Long ago I read over form 4473, and the conditions are very clear. They amount to the same four conditions I listed previously. Which one was violated? Here is testimony from the dealer who sold Cruz his rifle. If you think Cruz violated one of these conditions, which one?

 

[Authentic Nouveau]

I agree with that. It still does not prove Cruz could have legally stopped.

You have nothing so you roll into could have speculations.

Arm chair "expert"

What level of "interactions" with police qualifies as a reason to take away someone's guns? I posted earlier the only reasons for legally denying someone a gun in Florida in 2018:

• Convicted of a felony;
• Convicted of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence that renders them prohibited from purchasing a firearm;
• Had an adjudication of guilt withheld or imposition of sentence suspended on any felony or misdemeanor crime of domestic violence (unless 3 years have elapsed since probation or any other conditions set by the court have been fulfilled or expunction has occurred); or
• Been subject to certain court orders and adjudications related to a serious mental condition.

Which of these apply to Cruz?

Arm chair teevee court case expert

Long ago I read over form 4473, and the conditions are very clear. They amount to the same four conditions I listed previously. Which one was violated? Here is testimony from the dealer who sold Cruz his rifle. If you think Cruz violated one of these conditions, which one?