“The Point Of No Return”… are you past it yet?

fltom said:
You are still skipping over the point

According to Calvinism their emnity agaqinst Goid woiuld have prevented them from receiving the word with Joy

please deal with it
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As you have already agreed they never “truly” received the word.


fltom said:
God knows the heart and is able to discern when a true faith exists and when a spurious (fake) temporary believing exists
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… this is why they “fell away” remember?

“They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us.” (1Jn 2:19)

If they had been “true” they would have remained but they made it plain that they were not ever “true”… this is why they fell away.

Your assumption that they were “true” at any point is your faulty premise that you need to deal with.

…
 
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fltom said:
You are still skipping over the point

According to Calvinism their emnity agaqinst Goid woiuld have prevented them from receiving the word with Joy

please deal with it
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Nope, even the 5000 people Jesus feed with fish and bread received him with joy because he filled their bellies. (Matthew 14, Mark 6, Luke 9, John 6)

This proves you can “receive him with joy” for worldly reasons and still parish in the end.

Worldly receieving vs Spiritual receiving… only one is produced through regeneration.

Pointing at tares among the wheat does not help your argument.

“Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field: But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way. But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also. So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares? He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up? But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.” (Mat 13:24-30)

You have no argument against Calvinism until you first prove the tares were at any point wheat…

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Sketo said:
Nope, even the 5000 people Jesus feed with fish and bread received him with joy because he filled their bellies. (Matthew 14, Mark 6, Luke 9, John 6)

This proves you can “receive him with joy” for worldly reasons and still parish in the end.
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You are confounding the biblical record and your theology

Your theology teaches the unregenerate cannot receive the things of the Spirit

they hate God and are unable to respond positively to him

Sorry you cannot rescue your theology by denying it
 
fltom said:
You are confounding the biblical record and your theology

Your theology teaches the unregenerate cannot receive the things of the Spirit

they hate God and are unable to respond positively to him

Sorry you cannot rescue your theology by denying it
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Ditto . Hence my fallacy remark
 
fltom said:
You are confounding the biblical record and your theology

Your theology teaches the unregenerate cannot receive the things of the Spirit
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John 14:17 confirms my theology by stating...

even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, for he dwells with you and will be in you.

And 2 Cor 2:14-15 further confirms my theology by stating...

The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned. The spiritual person judges all things, but is himself to be judged by no one.

Natural Person vs Spiritual Person.

Your premise remains faulty and is contrary to scripture...

As stated in the OP...

Calvinists believe in Irresistible Grace which is a specific Grace God works in those purposed for salvation from before the world began. We believe that God appointed a time, within the timeline of creation, where the Holy Spirit would regenerate those purposed individuals such that they no longer perceive Christ crucified as foolishness but perceive him as the irresistible wisdom and power of God for salvation. Because of God’s gracious gift of change in perception Christ has become to us the Power that motivates us to endure to the end so as to be saved and inherit eternal life. Those purposed for salvation are acting out what God is working in them. This is how God saves his purposed people from beginning to end.

...
 
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fltom said:
According to Calvinism their emnity agaqinst Goid woiuld have prevented them from receiving the word with Joy
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Please quote a CALVINIST (eg. Spurgeon, Gill, Lloyd-Jones, MacArthur, Sproul, etc.) who teaches this.

If you cannot, then you CANNOT claim it is "according to Calvinism".
 
Chalcedon said:
John 1:12- synonymous terms

next
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Look... Nobody buys your false claim that you are "ignoring" me, since you respond to just about EVERY post I make. So do everyone a favour and quote the post you're referring to, so people can follow the discussion.

John 1:12 But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,

This about receiving "him" (Christ), not about receiving "the word", which is something different. The parable of the soils doesn't say they "received Christ with joy".
 
no one receives Christ apart from the word-the gospel- 1 Peter 1:3, 1:23 , James 1:18 , cf John 1:12-13

oops

next
 
Sketo said:
John 14:17 confirms my theology by stating...

even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, for he dwells with you and will be in you.

And 2 Cor 2:14-15 further confirms my theology by stating...

The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned. The spiritual person judges all things, but is himself to be judged by no one.

Natural Person vs Spiritual Person.

Your premise remains faulty and is contrary to scripture...

As stated in the OP...
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Er

Those in the parable received the word with joy

Why are you ignoring it
 
Theo1689 said:
Look... Nobody buys your false claim that you are "ignoring" me, since you respond to just about EVERY post I make. So do everyone a favour and quote the post you're referring to, so people can follow the discussion.

John 1:12 But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,

This about receiving "him" (Christ), not about receiving "the word", which is something different. The parable of the soils doesn't say they "received Christ with joy".
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Should we write that down to remind you later?
 
Theo1689 said:
Please quote a CALVINIST (eg. Spurgeon, Gill, Lloyd-Jones, MacArthur, Sproul, etc.) who teaches this.

If you cannot, then you CANNOT claim it is "according to Calvinism".
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Is believing a good thing?

IN the Westminster Confession the doctrine of Total Inability is stated as follows:—“Man, by his fall into a state of sin, hath wholly lost all ability of will to any spiritual good accompanying salvation; so as a natural man, being altogether averse from good, and dead in sin, is not able, by his own strength, to convert himself, or to prepare himself thereunto.”

Loraine Boettner, The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination (Phillipsburg, NJ: Presbyterian and Reformed Publishing Company, 1932), 61.
 
fltom said:
Is believing a good thing?

IN the Westminster Confession the doctrine of Total Inability is stated as follows:—“Man, by his fall into a state of sin, hath wholly lost all ability of will to any spiritual good accompanying salvation; so as a natural man, being altogether averse from good, and dead in sin, is not able, by his own strength, to convert himself, or to prepare himself thereunto.”

Loraine Boettner, The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination (Phillipsburg, NJ: Presbyterian and Reformed Publishing Company, 1932), 61.
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For the Lurkers...

You agree that before Grace or without Grace, this is true...

Unless Prevenient Faith is a Strawman?

If you want to teach Prevenient Faith, just finally admit it...
 
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fltom said:
Is believing a good thing?

IN the Westminster Confession the doctrine of Total Inability is stated as follows:—“Man, by his fall into a state of sin, hath wholly lost all ability of will to any spiritual good accompanying salvation; so as a natural man, being altogether averse from good, and dead in sin, is not able, by his own strength, to convert himself, or to prepare himself thereunto.”

Loraine Boettner, The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination (Phillipsburg, NJ: Presbyterian and Reformed Publishing Company, 1932), 61.
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No mention of "received the word with joy".

Oops!
 
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