Mary as Aeiparthenos; why?

[Bonnie]

Really. Hmm debateable and why just bring up this thing when what your priests did to the children who were born is as bad as abortion. They killed who God meant those children to be, they were changed by this evil experience from the leaders. Some committed suicide according to those who knew them well.

So many RCs in politics who do not follow agree with the RCC on this topic, by the way and who are affecting votes.

Abortion is off topic for this board anyway and is just a diversionary tactic.

 

[Bonnie]

We should remember too that all of this is taking place in heaven. Why is mary giving birth to Jesus in heaven? Isn't it recorded that she gave birth to Him in Bethlehem?

Rev 12
1 And a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars. 2 She was pregnant and was crying out in birth pains and the agony of giving birth.

This is a proof text catholics use to show us mary is IN heaven. It says exactly nothing about any alleged assumption but its their claim.

This entire passage is highly symbolic, but Catholics want it to be mostly literal.

 

[Bonnie]

By trying to honor Mary; the rcc casts dishonor on her. Consider what John the Baptist said:

JOHN 3:

30 He must increase, but I must decrease.
31 He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.
32 And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.
33 He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.
34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.
35 The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.

The false Mary of the rcc has not done this. She has sought glory for herself at the expense of her son. All you have to do is to read what she says during many of her "apparitions". Having thought about it, does the false Mary of the apparitions sound like this?......... :


LUKE 2:38 And Mary said, Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it unto me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her.

Strong's Concordance
doulé: female slave, bondmaid.
Original Word: δούλη, ης, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: doulé
Phonetic Spelling: (doo'-lay)
Definition: female slave, bondmaid
Usage: a female slave, bonds-maid.

True, about the apparitions. The apparition at Fatima, if I remember right, said that the world needs to be more dedicated to her "Immaculate heart." Devoted to HER, not to her divine Son. Right then and there, one can see this apparition is demonic in origin.

 

[Bonnie]

so where is Mary (the mother of Jesus Christ, who is God) then, in hell?

I suggest you reread carefully what balshan wrote. Nowhere did she or anyone else on here imply or hint Mary was anywhere except IN heaven, with her Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. She most certainly would NOT be in hell,

 

[Nondenom40]

This entire passage is highly symbolic, but Catholics want it to be mostly literal.

They take all these passages the wrong way. What should be figurative they interpret literally. What should be literal they take figuratively. A.T. Robertson said the more ecclesiastical your approach to the bible the further away you get.

 

[balshan]

Their souls are with God, but their bodies are in the grave. Paul even calls them the "dead in Christ." But being in heaven doesn't mean it is hunky-dory to pray to them for any reason. We have one advocate with the Father, Christ Jesus our Lord. He is the perfect advocate and intercessor, because not only is He fully God, He is fully man. He has one foot in each camp, so to speak. He knows the hearts and minds of all people. We know He answers prayers and He bids us to come to Him in prayer and ask Him anything in His Name. HIS Name, not His mother's.

The problem is the RCC declares who these souls are and no one knows. Who is or isn't alive in heaven is God's choice, not the RCC. By declaring certain people saints, they are saying they know who is in heaven. How do they declare a person a saint, is by answered prayers.

 

[balshan]

I suggest you reread carefully what balshan wrote. Nowhere did she or anyone else on here imply or hint Mary was anywhere except IN heaven, with her Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. She most certainly would NOT be in hell,

Thank you because I am sure Mary is in heaven but who knows in a few centuries what the RCC will believe. For centuries the ECFs onwards the teachings on Judas were he was condemned to hell. Modern RCC now doubts this teaching and in fact one leader said anyone who said that was a heretic.

With the RCC any teaching no matter how old can be changed. We never know if these teachings are dogmas or not because they will not be honest about what are unchangeable teachings or not.

Limbo apparently was a teaching never a doctrine or a dogma it was changed. Judas status was changed.

 

[balshan]

Abortion is off topic for this board anyway and is just a diversionary tactic.

Mary being the mother of the church certainly failed the victims of their leaders. I bet those children called out to her with tears of pain.

 

[RayneBeau]

I agree RCs love telling everyone not to judge and yet their institution judges where the dead have gone. As if evil men can judge the state of others.

Amazing isn't it? They can read men's hearts.

Yes, yours is such wise advice.
We dare not set ourselves up as judges of other people's eternal fate. It is much safer to leave that to God.
Nevertheless though, we must recognize that those who have turned away from sound doctrine in matters essential to salvation are condemning themselves. "He who does not believe has been judged already" John 3:18

 

[balshan]

Yes, yours is such wise advice.
We dare not set ourselves up as judges of other people's eternal fate. It is much safer to leave that to God.
Nevertheless though, we must recognize that those who have turned away from sound doctrine in matters essential to salvation are condemning themselves. "He who does not believe has been judged already" John 3:18

Yet RCs just don't understand the importance of the real gospel.

 

[RiJoRi]

Yet RCs just don't understand the importance of the real gospel.

But most Roman Catholics do not know the real gospel. ? Neither they nor their teachers know what it is. The RCC organization formally denied the real gospel at Trent, so systemically its importance is nil.

We've seen this time and again on here when a RC is asked what the gospel is, and their replies go everywhere but to the gospel. Totally clueless. ?

--Rich
"Esse quam videri"

 

[Stella1000]

But most Roman Catholics do not know the real gospel. ? Neither they nor their teachers know what it is. The RCC organization formally denied the real gospel at Trent, so systemically its importance is nil.

We've seen this time and again on here when a RC is asked what the gospel is, and their replies go everywhere but to the gospel. Totally clueless. ?

--Rich
"Esse quam videri"

In Scripture it was the Pharisees who played the gotcha game with the Word of God. But...

Matt 7 20 So then, by their fruit you will recognize them. 21 Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

 

[RayneBeau]

Yet RCs just don't understand the importance of the real gospel.

I agree. It all boils down to the fact that perhaps Roman Catholics either don't want to know, or they have simply chosen to refuse to know the real gospel. Their passion ought to be to proclaim the fundamentals of God's Holy Word with clarity and precision, in order to turn people away from the darkness of error.

 

[mica]

In Scripture it was the Pharisees who played the gotcha game with the Word of God. But...

Matt 7 20 So then, by their fruit you will recognize them. 21 Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

interesting verse. why then do catholics do the will of men when they claim they are His church?

 

[Beloved Daughter]

It the conclusion we come to based on the role she played in salvation history. She was God's chosen vessel to bring his son into the world. She is the new Eve and the ark of the new covenant....Her perpetual virginity is a result of understanding her role. I don't know if her perpetual virginity accomplishes anything in itself but understanding her as being the new Eve and the ark of the new covenant is big.

Except, the Bible knows nothing of her perpetual virginity. It's made up nonsense.

 

[RayneBeau]

But most Roman Catholics do not know the real gospel. ? Neither they nor their teachers know what it is. The RCC organization formally denied the real gospel at Trent, so systemically its importance is nil.

We've seen this time and again on here when a RC is asked what the gospel is, and their replies go everywhere but to the gospel. Totally clueless. ?

--Rich
"Esse quam videri"

Wow Rich! A powerful post loaded with truth! As Christians our mission should be to confront head-on the blindness and unbelief that will be the reason multitudes will one day hear the Lord say, "I never knew you; depart from Me." (Matt 7:23).
Again and again, it must be stressed that those who act as if crucial doctrines were of no consequence only heap the false teacher's guilt on themselves. Look at what it says in 2 John 11.

 

[RiJoRi]

In Scripture it was the Pharisees who played the gotcha game with the Word of God. But...

Matt 7 20 So then, by their fruit you will recognize them. 21 Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

Purple. (non sequitur)

 

[balshan]

In Scripture it was the Pharisees who played the gotcha game with the Word of God. But...

Matt 7 20 So then, by their fruit you will recognize them. 21 Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

Now it is the RCs who play various games with God's word, including the gotcha game.

Yep but Matt wasn't talking about your institution with the bad fruit, false doctrines and wolves for teachers. They are not doing the Father's will.

 

[balshan]

In Scripture it was the Pharisees who played the gotcha game with the Word of God. But...

Matt 7 20 So then, by their fruit you will recognize them. 21 Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

Ok how can scripture be a gotcha game. You are either using it correctly or you are not. Nothing gotcha about it. The Pharisees were misusing it, and so do RCs.

Jesus never took a step back from the Pharisees and neither will any true believer take a step back from the misuse of scripture by RCs.

 

[mica]

RiJoRi said:
But most Roman Catholics do not know the real gospel. ? Neither they nor their teachers know what it is. The RCC organization formally denied the real gospel at Trent, so systemically its importance is nil.

We've seen this time and again on here when a RC is asked what the gospel is, and their replies go everywhere but to the gospel. Totally clueless. ?

--Rich
"Esse quam videri"

In Scripture it was the Pharisees who played the gotcha game with the Word of God. But...

Matt 7 20 So then, by their fruit you will recognize them. 21 Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

what are you calling 'the gotcha game' in the above post?