What is the salvific effect of the Cross?

A new day said:
The rc encyclopedia, calls it a "gift". It is no longer a gift, if you have to work for it or earn it. Gifts are given by a giver, and the giver never demands payment for the gift. A gift is UNearned.
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gift because it is given for free but one has to freedom to accept or not to accept the gift.
 
A new day said:
We can't save ourselves from sin, if we could then Jesus didn't need to shed His blood on the cross. But He did, because we can't. He paid the penalty for us as a gift to us.

The day I heard the gospel, and fully believed and accepted that free gift from God, is a day I have never forgotten. All the burden of sin and guilt, washed away. And a joy just flooded over me. All is well between me and God. There is peace with God. And I didn't work for it in any way. I am at peace. We non-rc's want this peace for you too. Please believe us. It isn't initial either... we have experienced a permanent peace and joy.

I never have to wonder if I still have a tomorrow, or if I'm still right with God when I die. I don't wonder. For I know in my heart, that all is well between me and God. God is so wonderful and awesome! Wow, what a change there has been in my life after that day! I have a joy and peace in my heart that has no boundaries.

It is so wonderful to be declared by God, "not guilty". You have nothing to lose by fully trusting God to save you. And everything to gain by it. God is powerful enough to do it for you.
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redemption is universal but salvation is individual
when Jesus redeemed us, the benefits of that redemption have to be applied unceasingly to Christ’s members throughout their lives.
how does Jesus do this... through his mystical body.
when Jesus took a human nature, he lived on earth on that physical body. He redeemed us through that physical body.
when Jesus ascended, he lived on earth with his supernatural body, the body of his members. this is his mystical body.
Jesus redeemed us with his physical body and now he uses his mystical body to dispense the fruits/graces of his redemption.
what is this mystical? it is the divine institution he established, the church.
it is through baptism that we become members of this mystical body and everybody is invited to be saved (acts2: 32-40
 
ramcam2 said:
gift because it is given for free but one has to freedom to accept or not to accept the gift.
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Your NOT being kept from receiving the gift of life. This is the same crock that an atheist told me several years ago. Your using this as an excuse to NOT have to trust God. Lot of difference between head knowledge and trusting God with your life.
 
In that case, the distinction made in James 2:24, the pet verse of Catholic apologetics, makes no sense.
 
Mack said:
It is the blood on the cross not the blood in the cup which possesses salvific ability, Heb.9:22, Lev.17:11, Rom.3:25, Rev.1:5
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Are you saying that blood was in the cup?
Mack said:
When Jesus said this is my body and this is my blood He was speaking anachronistically not literally.
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When Christ said 'this is my body', He was holding His body in His hands.
 
Arch Stanton said:
Are you saying that blood was in the cup?

When Christ said 'this is my body', He was holding His body in His hands.
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No His blood was not in the cup because His blood was in His body
No. He was holding bread, a symbolic representation of his body. The fact that there was no blood in the cup and that it was bread in His hand was SELF-EVIDENT for everyone to see with their own eyes. What they saw was reality. They saw things as they were in the real world.
 
Mack said:
No His blood was not in the cup because His blood was in His body
No. He was holding bread, a symbolic representation of his body. The fact that there was no blood in the cup and that it was bread in His hand was SELF-EVIDENT for everyone to see with their own eyes. What they saw was reality. They saw things as they were in the real world.
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'This' must agree in gender to the noun it modifies.
 
ramcam2 said:
it looks like you cannot believe in the truthfulness of the direct statement of Jesus that the bread and wine is his body and blood. God cannot lie.
the absence of the statement that you are looking for does not prove anything against the truthfulness of the direct statement of Jesus .
you must believe with the eyes of faith that Jesus cannot lie. do not try to believe using physical means or reasoning.
can you find a verse that says the apostles did not believe the statement of jesus that the bread and wine is his body and blood? there is none.
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It "looks like" and sounds like Roman Catholics demand that just like themselves, all others must assume a neutral stance, a non-committal attitude towards the use and truthfulness of Scripture, as is commonly heard and used in the Roman Catholic arena.
 
Mack said:
No His blood was not in the cup because His blood was in His body
No. He was holding bread, a symbolic representation of his body. The fact that there was no blood in the cup and that it was bread in His hand was SELF-EVIDENT for everyone to see with their own eyes. What they saw was reality. They saw things as they were in the real world.
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God is infinite, God is Spirit and God is infinite and yet Jesus, who is fully man, is God. Did they really see things as they were in the real world?
 
dingoling. said:
God is infinite, God is Spirit and God is infinite and yet Jesus, who is fully man, is God. Did they really see things as they were in the real world?
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What they saw was SELF-EVIDENT. They did not see blood in the cup, and they did not see his literal body in his hand. It was SELF-EVIDENT Jesus was not speaking literally, He was speaking anachronistically.
 
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