Does God love everyone ?

Chalcedon said:
I have Scripture unlike you with ad hominems. We will see who is "embarrassed " .

So lets spell this out one more time with Scripture, the Bible . The Spirit comes after faith, confession, repentance.

Anyone granted eyes to see knows the order below and scripture is consistent in both testaments. The Spirit comes after believe, receive, confess, repent etc.......

Ezekiel 18:30-32
“Therefore, you Israelites, I will judge each of you according to your own ways, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent! Turn away from all your offenses; then sin will not be your downfall. Rid yourselves of all the offenses you have committed, and get a new heart and a new spirit. Why will you die, people of Israel? For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent and live!

Notice what comes first

1- Repent , turn away from sin
2- the after you repent you get a new heart/spirit ( calvinism- regeneration, new life)
3- repent then you live, have life- ie new heart, spirit.

John has the same order in in his opening of the gospel and in his purpose statement for writing his gospel. Receive, Believe, Birth

John 1:12-13
“Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

Same order as above receive, believe, call on Him then the new birth follows.

John 20:31
“But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

Once again the order is consistent with the OT- belief/repentance precedes life.


Romans 10:8-13
But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,” that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim: 9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved. 11 As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.” 12 For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, 13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”


Again above we see its hearing the gospel, believing the message , confessing then calling upon the Lord results in salvation.

Acts tells us the same order in 11:18- "So then, God has granted even the Gentiles repentance unto life.” Repent precedes life.

Paul confirms the order in Ephesians below as well. Hearing and believing precedes the Holy Spirit that we were sealed with not before belief.

Ephesians 1:13
“And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit

In Acts below the Spirit comes after repentance

Acts 2:38
Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

In Galatians the Spirit comes after hearing, believing, receiving

Galatians 3:2
I would like to learn just one thing from you: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law, or by hearing with fath?
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Faith is given by God. Wicked people don't seek God and don't have genuine faith. Without the Spirit of God, people don't understand truth and don't belong to God.

2 Corinthians 2:14
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Romans 8:8-9
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
 
Chalcedon said:
I have Scripture unlike you with ad hominems. We will see who is "embarrassed " .

So lets spell this out one more time with Scripture, the Bible . The Spirit comes after faith, confession, repentance.

Anyone granted eyes to see knows the order below and scripture is consistent in both testaments. The Spirit comes after believe, receive, confess, repent etc.......

Ezekiel 18:30-32
“Therefore, you Israelites, I will judge each of you according to your own ways, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent! Turn away from all your offenses; then sin will not be your downfall. Rid yourselves of all the offenses you have committed, and get a new heart and a new spirit. Why will you die, people of Israel? For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent and live!

Notice what comes first

1- Repent , turn away from sin
2- the after you repent you get a new heart/spirit ( calvinism- regeneration, new life)
3- repent then you live, have life- ie new heart, spirit.

John has the same order in in his opening of the gospel and in his purpose statement for writing his gospel. Receive, Believe, Birth

John 1:12-13
“Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

Same order as above receive, believe, call on Him then the new birth follows.

John 20:31
“But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

Once again the order is consistent with the OT- belief/repentance precedes life.


Romans 10:8-13
But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,” that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim: 9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved. 11 As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.” 12 For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, 13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”


Again above we see its hearing the gospel, believing the message , confessing then calling upon the Lord results in salvation.

Acts tells us the same order in 11:18- "So then, God has granted even the Gentiles repentance unto life.” Repent precedes life.

Paul confirms the order in Ephesians below as well. Hearing and believing precedes the Holy Spirit that we were sealed with not before belief.

Ephesians 1:13
“And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit

In Acts below the Spirit comes after repentance

Acts 2:38
Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

In Galatians the Spirit comes after hearing, believing, receiving

Galatians 3:2
I would like to learn just one thing from you: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law, or by hearing with faith?

Galatians 3:14
He redeemed us in order that the blessing promised to Abraham would come to the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, so that by faith we might receive the promise of the Spirit.

James and Peter have the same exact order in James 1:18 , 1 Peter 1:23.

See how scripture is consistent when you do not read your doctrine into it but read it objectively, without bias ?

conclusion : the Spirit comes after faith , belief, receiving, repentance, confession, not before.

back to the calvie drawing board you have been thoroughly defeated with Scripture that exposes your erroneous conclusions regarding the Holy Spirit.

Summary:

The Biblical order- notice where new life, regeneration is on the list from Scripture.

1- the preaching of the gospel- Rom 10
2- the hearing of the gospel- Rom 10
3- belief in the gospel- John 1:12
4- receiving the gospel- John 1:12
5- repentance Luke 5:32
6- the new birth that results in #7
7- salvation, eternal life- John 1:13
8- Justification- Rom 8:30
9- Sanctification- Rom 8
10- Glorification Rom 8:30

oops

next

hope this helps !!!
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And you embarrassed yourself again.
Don't you know that none of those scriptures causes God to owe you mercy and compassion compassion as you believe they do?

You and your hand clapping friends think that your sovereign will determines God's actions towards you.

Obviously you despise the sovereignty of God and think you dictate to Him.

Your post above has not proven that you will to be born again.
Neither does it show that through your pathetic lost will that hates/hated God that it causes His mercy and compassion towards you.

It's only in your depravity and self love that you think you are so great that you were able to pick God and forced Him to respond to your choices.

God will seperate the goats from the sheep. Those on His left will protest as their sovereign will chose God. He will say get away for I never knew you..
You and your buddies think God knows you because you chose for Him to know you...

You can believe you chose God all you want. Take that glory for yourself. It stinks to high heaven. You, you you. It's all you as you clearly display.
When will you give God the glory due Him alone for salvation? - Oh, never mind you cannot. You don't believe God when He says His mercy and compassion is not dependent on your will or exertion. That would rob you of the glory you seek for self and self choices
 
T
Chalcedon said:
I love the calvinists they just drive me to Scripture to prove them wrong. Its a win win :)
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The sad thing is when people mis-use scripture and then think they proved their sovereign will trumps God's sovereignty.

You have been thoroughly unable to prove Paul a liar when he wrote that God's mercy and compassion is not dependent on human will or exertion.

All you managed to prove is that you have no spiritual discernment and that you are more interested in the praise of men than you ever have been for glorifying God.

You think your self will glorifies God and not self.
How utterly mindless
 
Chalcedon said:
I love the calvinists they just drive me to Scripture to prove them wrong. Its a win win :)
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I am ashamed for Arminians who post scriptures and believe their scriptures somehow prove that the self will glorifies God.

That's how confused they are. They seek to glorify self and not God and are so desperate that they read self glorification into scripture then strut around as if they achieved some victory. Well congratulations you managed to prove how YOU believe scripture teaches self glorification.

None of those scriptures you posted proves that your will determines something God has to do in response to man.

But keep glorifying self, at least you are getting the praise of man you so seperately seek, for you are most certainly not giving God ANY glory.
 
Johnnybgood said:
Yes God loves everyone, thank you
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But are you saying that the whole world doesn't lie in wickedness? That God doesn't hate Esau? That God loves the workers of iniquity? That God loves the goats but the sheep met certain requirements because not everyone could meet the same requirements but something caused the sheep to understand the requirements or to want to meet them? Is man's will as strong or stronger than God's? Why didn't Jonah tell God to take hike?

Romans 9
14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid. 15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

Does God have that perogative? Did Calvin give it to Him?

Romans 9
16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. 17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. 18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

God has to follow someone else's rules in order to be fair?
 
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Was I given the same free will as my five siblings? One has passed away without God. Four are living and strongly opposed to Christianity. Was my free will different from the free will they were given?
 
Johnnybgood said:
Read Ephesians 2
And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
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Exactly! Why didn't He save my sister? Why are my four adult siblings opposed to Christianity? Why did my parents die without Christ?
 
Johnnybgood said:
Read Ephesians 2
And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
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Who did He quicken? One out of six children? Does He quicken every person on earth to have faith in Christ before they die?
 
Janice Bower said:
Does Eph. 2 say EVERY CHILD OF WRATH has been quickened?
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It says we were by nature children of wrath. Meaning, in our lost, fallen, condemned state, we acted no differently than those who die lost. Romans 9 tells us the elect at no point were vessels of wrath but vessels of mercy. But the vessels of mercy prior to being saved acted just as bad, if not worse, than the vessels of wrath.
 
ReverendRV said:
Yes...

You had a Renewing of the Mind...
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Or, she chose to accept Jesus Christ as her lord and her siblings chose to reject Jesus.

There are several points on which there is confusion about what is meant by free will. Some have said that it refers to the ability to desire. But a better definition is that it is the ability to decide between alternatives. Desire is a passion, an emotion; but will is a choice between two or more desires. Also, some think that to be free means that there can be no limitation of alternatives—one must be able to do whatever he wants. But the opposite of freedom is not fewer alternatives, it is being forced to choose one thing and not another. Freedom is not in unlimited options, but in unfettered choice between whatever options there are. As long as the choosing comes from the individual rather than an outside force, the decision is made freely. Free will means the ability to make an unforced decision between two or more alternatives (Geisler & Brooks 1990:63).
 
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Johnnybgood said:
It’s called free will . God does not take people by force against their will . I will gladly interact with you and your questions.
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Who gave them their will? Did Jonah volunteer to be swallowed by the fish?


Jonah 1 NIV
17 Now the Lord provided a huge fish to swallow Jonah, and Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights.
 
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