Who makes intercession ...

Stella1000 said:
The practice is not based on 'possibility' but prophecy. Our Lady appeared to St Dominic in the 12th century and later Blessed Alan de la Roche in the 15th century making promises regarding the powerful intercession of the Rosary. Again, the little prophets the Fatima children and Bernadette of Lourdes give us further assurance of Mary's intercessory role. Do Christians outside the Church still even accept prophecy? Has it gone the way of other supernatural gifts of the Holy Spirit, that is, just myths or theories with no real world substance anymore?
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Neither scripture, Jesus, nor the apostles spoke of any prophecies regarding your post.
 
Stella1000 said:
Do Christians outside the Church...
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(technically an oxymoron)
Stella1000 said:
... still even accept prophecy? Has it gone the way of other supernatural gifts of the Holy Spirit, that is, just myths or theories with no real world substance anymore?
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Certainly there are Christians who believe in and accept that prophecy is for today. There are some who do not. But all prophecy must be compared to the written word of God. (See Deut. 18, Deut. 13, and 1Cor 12-14.) There are those who claim to be prophets, yet fail the Deuternomic tests: either what they prophesy does not come to pass, or the message contradicts what God has already told us. We must weigh what is said, and come to a conclusion of the validity of the prophet and the prophecy. Note that in the O.T., being a false prophet was a capital crime, so God considers leading His people astray to be A Very Serious Matter.

--Rich
"Esse quam videri"
 
RiJoRi said:
(technically an oxymoron)

Certainly there are Christians who believe in and accept that prophecy is for today. There are some who do not. But all prophecy must be compared to the written word of God. (See Deut. 18, Deut. 13, and 1Cor 12-14.) There are those who claim to be prophets, yet fail the Deuternomic tests: either what they prophesy does not come to pass, or the message contradicts what God has already told us. We must weigh what is said, and come to a conclusion of the validity of the prophet and the prophecy. Note that in the O.T., being a false prophet was a capital crime, so God considers leading His people astray to be A Very Serious Matter.

--Rich
"Esse quam videri"
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Amen
 
PeanutGallery said:
Neither scripture, Jesus, nor the apostles spoke of any prophecies regarding your post.
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How do you interpret Paul to the Corinthians here...

1 Cor 12 7 To each is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good. 8 To one is given through the Spirit the utterance of wisdom and to another the utterance of knowledge according to the same Spirit, 9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit, 10 to another the working of powerful deeds, to another prophecy, to another the discernment of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, to another the interpretation of tongues. 11 All these are activated by one and the same Spirit, who allots to each one individually just as the Spirit chooses.

Or here...

1 Cor 14 3 But those who prophesy speak to other people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation.
 
RiJoRi said:
Certainly there are Christians who believe in and accept that prophecy is for today. There are some who do not. But all prophecy must be compared to the written word of God. (See Deut. 18, Deut. 13, and 1Cor 12-14.) There are those who claim to be prophets, yet fail the Deuternomic tests: either what they prophesy does not come to pass, or the message contradicts what God has already told us. We must weigh what is said, and come to a conclusion of the validity of the prophet and the prophecy. Note that in the O.T., being a false prophet was a capital crime, so God considers leading His people astray to be A Very Serious Matter.
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Prophecy by definition is to reveal by divine inspiration, what is previously hidden or secret. The authenticity of the prophet should be tested but what he/she reveals is an aspect of a mystery. That isn't something that is explicit in the scriptures, discerned simply by intellectual study.
 
Stella1000 said:
Prophecy by definition is to reveal by divine inspiration, what is previously hidden or secret. The authenticity of the prophet should be tested but what he/she reveals an aspect of a mystery. That isn't something that is explicit in the scriptures, discerned simply by intellectual study.
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I see the RC definition of prophecy. Really is that so, is that why your institution thinks it can go against scripture. That is a very poor definition, Prophecy is a message from God, it can be a foretelling, a warning but it is not revealing previously hidden things. Prophecy will NOT go against God's word.

got questions gives a good definition:

Prophecy at its most basic definition is “a message from God.” So, to prophesy is to proclaim a message from God. The one who does this is, therefore, a prophet. Although foretelling is often associated with prophecy, revealing the future is not a necessary element of prophecy; however, since only God knows the future, any authoritative word about the future must of necessity be a prophecy, that is, a message from God... First, he must not direct people to follow other gods. Second, whenever the prophet says something about future events, those events must come to pass. If the prophet promotes the worship of false gods, or if his predictions fail to come to pass, then he is a false prophet.

To be a prophet is serious and the punishments for false prophecy is harsh.
 
PeanutGallery said:
Rom 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

Rom 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Where is the verse which states Mary, Mother of God, makes intercession for us?
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Here:


Wanna see it again??
 
Stella1000 said:
The authenticity of the prophet should be tested but what he/she reveals is an aspect of a mystery. That isn't something that is explicit in the scriptures, discerned simply by intellectual study.
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Then how can you test the authenticity of a prophet? By waving your hands while chanting "Tu-tu-tu-tu"? (DW & I have seen this.) By whether or not you get shivers? Or feel good about it? Or do you just hand off responsibility to someone who claims they have discernment, and trust and hope that they do not have an ulterior motive, or are themselves deceived?

False prophets will come up with all sorts of excuses for why their prophecies fail, including "Oh, it's a mystery", and "You need to understand it spiritually", or some such non-sense. Look up Millerites, or Helen G. White, or Harold Camping. Or going 'way back, Montanus.

--Rich
"Esse quam videri"
 
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RiJoRi said:
Then how can you test the authenticity of a prophet? By waving your hands while chanting "Tu-tu-tu-tu"? (DW & I have seen this.) By whether or not you get shivers? Or feel good about it? Or do you just hand off responsibility to someone who claims they have discernment, and trust and hope that they do not have an ulterior motive, or are themselves deceived?

False prophets will come up with all sorts of excuses for why their prophecies fail, including "Oh, it's a mystery", and "You need to understand it spiritually", or some such non-sense. Look up Millerites, or Helen G. White, or Harold Camping. Or going 'way back, Montanus.

--Rich
"Esse quam videri"
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The Church has a very involved process of testing the spiritual character of a prophet which can take hundreds of years in some cases. They must have proven to live pure godliness to be authentic.

How does your church determine an authentic prophet?
 
Stella1000 said:
How do you interpret Paul to the Corinthians here...

1 Cor 12 7 To each is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good. 8 To one is given through the Spirit the utterance of wisdom and to another the utterance of knowledge according to the same Spirit, 9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit, 10 to another the working of powerful deeds, to another prophecy, to another the discernment of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, to another the interpretation of tongues. 11 All these are activated by one and the same Spirit, who allots to each one individually just as the Spirit chooses.

Or here...

1 Cor 14 3 But those who prophesy speak to other people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation.
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Which prophecies in 1Cor spoke of the upcoming Mary apparitions and rosaries?
 
Stella1000 said:
The Church has a very involved process of testing the spiritual character of a prophet which can take hundreds of years in some cases. They must have proven to live pure godliness to be authentic.
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Just to be grumpy, how in the world does the RCC determine that the prophets have lived "pure godliness", especially after "hundreds of years"?
And by what standard is the alleged prophet tested?
Stella1000 said:
How does your church determine an authentic prophet?
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See #42.

--Rich
"Esse quam videri"
 
Stella1000 said:
The Church has a very involved process of testing the spiritual character of a prophet which can take hundreds of years in some cases. They must have proven to live pure godliness to be authentic.

How does your church determine an authentic prophet?
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As it did with JP II? Isn't he officially a Saint in your church?
 
Bonnie said:
As it did with JP II? Isn't he officially a Saint in your church?
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Yes. JPII was so obviously an open book and a living Saint. There was a universal call for his elevation as so many Catholics were drawn to his heavenly intercession immediately after his death.
 
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